People know what is inside the tank but not what everything is made out of
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I’m not a tank commander, I was a driver. But there’s multiple TCs I know who agree with the spall liners, since it was noted in multiple public outlets that spall lining was included in our armor packages directly into the walls.
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Pretty compelling, was there anymore more on the following page about the DU and armor layout?
Like I said in the previous post, it’s been noted in multiple public outlets that spall lining was included in our armor packages directly into the walls. And yes, we still wear flak vests as well, because why wouldn’t you decrease the chances of any additional spall.
But if you all need proof of how little spalling there is, I can bring up the case of Bravo 22 in Iraq when it was struck in the side by a tandem warhead HEAT round.
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Italy is out of priority as always. Well look, when I asked why some nations have so little packs in the store, they say it doesn’t make commercial sense to make them for smaller playerbases.
So smaller playerbases always have lower priority, from premium options to damage models.
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You don’t need to convince me that a modern MBT would be fitted with spall liners.
Gaijin’s insistence of primary sources is asinine they should have never modeled vehicles in the first place if they can not find proper documentation on them.
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To fit an Abrams with Spall Liners requires around 2.5 tons of added weight. Rather than stressing the tank further, the Military simply fitted the crew with Flak Vests. Just because nations can afford something does not mean it is optimal for them.
The Abrams is already too fat as it is.
Internal Armor Spall Liners does not make sense on a basic level. If it sits in the middle of two plates, then it will just create more spall exiting through the second plate. This is basic logic.
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The SEPv2 likely does not have DU hull upgrades because the package was made to primarily fight in Urban Warfare. With the Collapse of the Soviet Union, there was no need to spend exorbitant amounts of money on something that would never get used and would make the fattening Abrams even harder to work with.
The SEPv3 does have DU, but other than the prototypes Gaijin mentioned, it was not standard for the SEPv2.
However, I do believe it would be appropriate to add it as Gaijin has given the T-80B its prototype Thermals. Either as an Armor Package to the current SEPv2 in game or as a folded prototype vehicle.
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Then why would they need to remove the DU armor from the hull of the M1A1 going to Ukraine if there was no DU in it?
and all of the upgrades from M1A1 onward either increases armor (protection) or keeps it the same so if they have DU hulls in M1A1 then every model after that would still have it right?
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He never states that they removed the M1A1SA’s DU. He never states it even has DU. He states that the Abrams being sent doesn’t have DU.
You’re falling for confirmation Bias.
Even if he did say it had DU, a youtuber isn’t a good source no matter their background if they don’t show evidence. This is just a YouTube Short talking about news dude.
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Do we have a source on that? that number sounds absurdly high (just going by personal knowledge and logic, i might be wrong).
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Yes, we do. It has been posted here constantly and featured regularly.
Ground Vehicle System Integration (GVSI) and Design Optimization Model. (dtic.mil)
Page 57 under Spall Liners
I want to see the Abrams be buffed as much as anyone else, but we shouldn’t make things up to do so. There are other ways we can do this.
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Fat with what
What’s in the tank that makes it so fat
I wonder
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Bro, Sep v3 did not start until fy 2020. The biden administration came out last year say they were going to start using hulls from m1 in storage to speed up the production to get Ukrainian tanks faster.
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Larger gun, ERA, new system components, DU turret inserts present on the HC onwards.
If you actually cared for evidence, you would have noticed that a Spall Liner would require nearly three additional tons on top of its current weight. That would bring it into the 70-ton weight class with the Challenger 3.
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oh wow. that’s a lot of weight.
in my head it does not sound right.
(note that this is not an argument for Abrams having spall liner, i’m just trying to make sense of the weight for my own sanity)
for example Kevlar KM2 (the one US military uses) weighs about 1.44g per cubic cm (using 1.5g for math convenience).
so if you want a 1cm thick liner it weighs 15kg per square meter (1.5x100.00/1000).
Lets say you double that (or use a better and denser kevlar) for more protection making it 30kg per square meter.
Lets count on the very high end here and guess you need 20 square meters to cover the inside of the tank. that makes it 600kg (30x20) now add some thin metal, lets say 2mm steel at 7.85g per cubic centimeters making it 7.85/5=1.57 (1.6 for ease of math) grams per square centimeter or 1.6x100.00/1000=16kg per square meter. again 20 square meters used to count high gives (16x20) 320kg
soo 600kg 2cm thick kevlar and 320kg 2mm steel gives 920kg total, lets round that out to add mounting hardware and such making it 1000kg or one metric ton.
now keep in mind that i counted high on every number here and even made the kevlar quite thick.
so how that becomes 2 metric tonnes by their calculations i do not understand.
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The SEPv2 was a 2000s Era tank used primarily against Urban Combat. At the time, the threat was RPG type warheads and missiles, not Kinetic Penetrators. DU was not seen as necessary for the production run until the v3.
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I do not know much about the math behind it. It’s just what they say. I’ve also been told that Kevlar is a general term referring to several things in the military.
I am simply putting forward a document you requested. Anything I say is less valuable than what is inside that Document.
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The sep v2 is a 2007 tank with multiple blocks inside it like every other tank. The SEP v1 was likely featuring the 5 prototype with hull armor. Hence why they removed the limit of 5 hulls on the 2006 licenses.
Show documentation and prove Gaijin wrong. That is how these things work. Assumptions do not cut it.
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