Speed survivability, penetration, etc
You can literally spit on the hstvl and the aiming drive is dead now. Offroad the frontal speed is about the same as a t80 which is 95% of the maps and you can’t even frontally pen a 2a7 in the lfp
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95% of the maps are city maps.
You can’t pen the lfp of a 2a7 with the 2s38 either…
But it’s good the hstvl got a nerf, for the longest time a penetration did nothing, and furthermore, 3bm60 and DM 53 often bounce off the Hstvl due to angle.
There’s like 4 maps that have roads as the main source of travel.
You can adjust for aim with the 2s38 much quicker since the reload is .5s instead of 1.5s.
The ammo quantity is 5.5x the amount found in the HSTVL.
The difference between the HSTVL and 2s38 in penetration values are naught at top tier.
The HSTVL aims for the same targets a 2s38 would.
HSTVL requires more than 2 shots to get through Spall and ERA from the side and one for a potential kill shot. That’s 4.5 seconds worth of time vs the 1.5 second it would take the 2s38.
4.5 seconds is much closer to an MBT’s reload than 1.5 seconds, so there is higher risk of a counter shot.
Also another mention is ERA. The abrams era does not have enough KE to even prevent one shot to the hull, whereas the t90 will reliably deflect 885.
Lastly and most importantly, there is no gunner in the turret of the 2s38 so don’t tell me the HSTVL is more survivable
HSTVL
2s38
almost no difference with a much faster fire rate.
HSTVL
2s38
Mind you 11.7 br vs 10.3. it’s absolutely ridiculous
8 Likes
TL;DR
The Hstvl is good as is, I guess Germany’s Turm III should become a 11.0 then eh? I shot ERA directly on a T-90 with HEAT-FS went through fully and killed the whole tank.
It’s common knowledge Russian tanks have more side armor… but what will pen frontal weakpoints Better? Hstvl
Which has far more versatility in urban and open combat? Hstvl
Which has a higher sustained fire rate? 2s38
Let’s not forget, the 2s38 is pretty much a premium aa, which USA gets the Sgt. York, which has one of the best radars for spaa in game. It’s also been around a lot longer, and it can in fact kill a T-72 frontally…. So you’re really barking up the wrong tree.
I haven’t even spaded my hstvl yet and I find it quite good.
Not really considering the 2s38 can easily frontally pen every high tier MBT except the Leopard2/Strv122 pretty much the same as the HSTVL. IDK about Merkava’s, really can’t remember fighting many in the 2s38 or hstvl. The higher fire rate of the 2s38 also helps guarantee a higher likely hood of killing or crippling the target given how both platforms suffer from weak post pen due to being small caliber APFSDS
That’s highly debatable given the 2s38 has more ammo, a wider variety of ammo, an unmanned turret, faster fire rate, and better thermals… both tanks have strengths and weaknesses I would not say the hstvl is more versatile like it’s a fact
Ummm not a great comparison but I’ll go through it anyways. In a pure AA comparison the York wins but that’s barely given the 2s38 has better optics/thermals and a longer range higher damaging shell. But the 2s38 isn’t an AA in game, it can take a full load of APFSDS/APHE it can kill plenty of tanks and still engage air fairly well while the York can’t, it lost its 40mm AP a long time ago. Also the York has so little survivability it can’t even be quantified
Yeah no it can’t. Can it make a lucky meme shot on the top of the breech of a T series or bounce into the top hull? Yes it can. Can any SPAA 30mm or above also do this ? Yes they can. Ive done it and it’s happened to me but it’s exceedingly rare. 99/100 times T series beats York unless the T series player is very dumb or already crippled.
3 Likes
You’re right’s maps dictate how any tank plays however Russian MBTs have been having no issues facing other MBTs with greater gun depression and a better reverse speed. Why? Lot of maps are very CQC, and the map design includes are gradually becoming flatter or there are there are many areas of the maps that don’t need that -10 degrees of depression. That is the point.
When the 2S38 got it’s internal modules added, it was a major nerf, what did they do? Uncapped the limitation with the ready rack. That is a major buff.
When the HSTVL got it’s internal modules added, it was a major nerf. It relies on light armor and empty spaces. What did they do? Nothing. As I said before I have no issues with the HSTVL being accurate but give it a buff to compensate. Giving it it’s accurate round (Delta 3) would be fair as it has enough pen and damage to be reliable but not OP. It still needs aim for weakspots and such.
Or I’m also okay with the HSTVL getting a larger ammo pool and faster ROF. Though this can be seen as historically inaccurate.
If the 2S38, only had VT rounds, no one would be complaining. The reason why it’s such a good tank is because it’s such a multi-purpose machine. At it’s BR, it can engage MBTs, light tanks, and helis/aircraft with ease. It doesn’t need to worry about ammo count.
2 Likes
All that green spots, if my 8.3 TURM III sees it then it will still be one-tabbed, not needing an 8.3 actually, King Tiger will do it at 6.7, wait… no need King Tiger, Tiger H1 or T-34-85 will OHKO it as well, doesn’t matter if its an Abrams, exposing that side of your Leopard 2, T-80BVM, Leclerc, and any other 12.0s will get one-tab bro, anything sees that side will KO it, that side of MBTs can’t even take a hit from PUMA, even the rattiest rat Fox will pen it bro
That’s my point. The HSTVL should be lower tiered. 10.3 or 10.7 max. Almost every 11.7+ tank is on par with the HSTVL’s off road speed but they have better pen, armor and thermals (this thing has gen 1) It’s in a dire need of delta 6 ammo which it has historically used that could penetrate nato heavy triple. I don’t know why Gaijin used the first generation ammo instead of the later version perhaps for balancing at the time. With the updated ammo and the aiming drive fixed, then it would be worthy of 11.7. It’s odd people are so defensive when it comes to fixing Us ground. Do you guys enjoy a challenge or seal clubbing? Between the Abrams being modeled wrong in three locations (turret ring, breach missing a chunk of armor, and the lower mantlet), the HSTVL, and Adats severely under-performing, ground isn’t fun for US mains. That’s why you see such an intensity of CAS, and US mains taking to the forums.
1 Like
At best the Hstvl would be a 11.3, anything lower is criminal. it’s fine where it is right now.
We agree to disagree
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Considering your stats are decently below average, I have to say you have to master its gameplay. It’s like the abrams, how everyone complains about it. Yet it was absolutely fine before the buff but nobody plays them right
Rich coming from a Russia/China main
China main??? Lmao I hardly have touched China. If anything I’m more a USA/ Russia main. Have top tier in both naval, ground, and air.
I’ll just leave this here.
I see, 5 premium US tanks with zero grinding for researching modifications. You don’t know the pain of laser range finders and m829a2 at the end of the research tree. Fine you’re a good player, I’ll give you that but that does not allow you to try and invalidate points because you’re “better”.
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Except the turret ring is bugged, the lower mantlet is bugged and the breach is completely missing part of it’s armor. Sure it’s fine if you play the Abrams like a light tank for which it is NOT.
Yea they’re bugged alright, eating every particle of spall
Keep in mind the 152mm dart went through the drivers arm, into the gunner leg, and into the commanders foot
I have played the squadron abrams, didn’t find it all that bad. Just had to be more precise until I got my apfsds
Plus the unrealistic 5.0 sec reload makes life easy
That’s how bad the Abrams model is lol.
Peep this when you get a chance. Like how was this missed?