Have the option of swapping in and our of SPAA in the spawn area, dynamic class!

Last game my team were getting murdered by planes/helis. After a 500kg bomb blew me across the map I switched to my Skink, drove around the map for a good 5m but only encountered 1 Heli which despite firing 1000 rounds at it and a good few hits I couldn’t bring it down (stoopid, useless Skink) it eventually lost interest and wandered off. After a few more minutes of driving around I was bored, lots of tank action happening but nothing was flying.

I ended up joining a tank skirmish and was killed 2 secs later, but at least I was able to get out of the boring SPAA.

Made me think at least give SPAA’s the option of returening to a spawn area and getting out of the SPAA into something useful. It’s a boring class to play even with things in the air but when they lose interest in flying its down snooze fest.

Another reason a lot of people I play this game with say the same thing ‘boring, low reward, high risk’.


I’d go one further, I’d like the option to swap to an SPAA without giving up my tank, similar to how it now works with nuke planes and aircraft in Arcade. Basically, you hit a button, your tank remains on the field, and you get control of an SPAA in spawn. You could then react to whatever airborne threat you saw, and once that’s done you could swap back to your tank, assuming it hasn’t been found and killed by the enemy first.

My justification for this is simple. SPAA is currently too reactive. Spawning an SPAA proactively risks runinng into no aircraft, which in the majority of AA with limited AT potential makes you functionally useless, and forced to either suicide or sit around in spawn, achieving nothing.

Accordingly, you need to play SPAAs reactively, spawning them specifically when you know there are enemy aircraft to engage. The trouble with that is how it usually plays out of the player. You can spot CAS coming as an aware tanker (Especially helicopters), but unless the player dies to some unrelated cause soon after that, most players make the reasonable assumption that during the time they spent doing other things, the CAS was probably already engaged and so they’d be better off taking another tank. It’s not like they can doublecheck in the spawnscreen.

The alternative version is that the CAS kills the player, which does allow them to engage with some certainty, but isn’t an ideal version of events in terms of player annoyance. Regardless of how they end up reactively in SPAA, even if the player got to engage and destroy the CAS, he is back in the position of the proactive SPAA player. He can either hope for a steady stream of CAS to stay relevant, or he can rush in to suicide and get into another tank.

In my proposed system, players with good spatial awareness who find themselves in a lull in the fighting and spot CAS coming can proactively swap out, quickly engage the threat, then swap back again to continue the fight on the ground. No deadtime waiting for CAS that may or may not show up. Reduced chances of a CAS plane finding a completely undefended team that it can pick apart at it’s leisure. It rewards players with good situational awareness, and it makes SPAA more relevant in their intended roles, without requiring them to also double as effective AT/Scouts.


I’m a very big fan of this idea. Being able to switch in and out of SPAA like with a light tank’s scout drone would be fantastic.

A reason for lineups and actually taking note of your trained crews in your lineup is as if it requires you to think ahead and plan.

I take 3 SPAA in my lineups on the regular.


Lets see… IRL tank crews aren’t trained on SPAAs and vice versa. So thats a no-go from a realisticism perspective.
You can accomplish what you are asking for already by J-ing out. IIRC you don’t get hit with repairs if you aren’t damaged, but don’t quote me on that.

I guess if you don’t do anything but hang out in the spawn waiting for planes to come to you. But things get very unboring when you push forward and try contribute to the ground game. And survive… mostly survive.


First, no you still pay repair cost for J-ing out, where the hell did you hear this?
And second, the entire point is so that one does not have to throw away a tank just to use their SPAA and counter an aircraft, and then throw away that SPAA as well so they can get back in the ground fight.

Because an Ozelot, Roland, or Type 81 are gonna do a lot of “contributing” to the ground game. Uh huh.

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For the record I never stay in the spawn in a SPAA.

I always try and follow 2 or 3 heavy tanks around at a distance as those things attract Bombers like a fat kid to a cupcake.


If allowed swap the loadout of CAS, I agree, and SPAA’s invincibility need be removed after it firing.

To be fair, I wouldn’t mind the option of a zone CAS can fly into that allows them to jump out of their plane and back onto the ground, with the option of re-earning the plane after a timer elapses. Because speaking of time wastage, that period after CAS has dropped it’s useful ordinance is a prime example. They can either loiter around, spotting tanks with their MGs and praying to find something squishy to strafe, or they can RTB, which removes a player from the match for several minutes. Hell, often times if I’m in that situation and I see a need to get back on the ground to help win the game, I’ll just kamikazi something, which is basically equivalent to an SPAA J’ing out because no CAS is spawning.

I see no harm in allowing players to avoid this time wastage, if they choose, by getting them back on the ground quickly. And, especially if combined with my above changes, it shouldn’t increase the frequency of CAS to unbearable levels. Just slap a 5 minute timer on the CAS being “rearmed”, and allow them to earn that plane back again for the same (or maybe slightly increased?) SP cost later, if they so choose.

Is this not just a good consequence to vehicle choice? And at lower/mid tiers the AFs are relatively close (depending on map) and over a 25 minute match duration it is not that time consuming to land and spawn a new vehicle. There are another 15 or so players after all who I am sure can miss one player who might well have created a decent enough impact (AA or AG duties).

I believe any “respawn/swap” mechanics at the Spawn is a poor addition (ref: mid to low BRs). Hanging around spawn is poor effort in my opinion and a bug bear of mine has been the SPAA not leaving spawn because they think this works (as planes will spam spawn knowing people do this = why SPAA get their easier kills or planes get their easier kills, dependant on player quality and maybe some luck), hence a part of the experience of SPAA being so poor (I never sat on spawn in a vehicle, it is an easy target even if it might appear to be “lucrative” for some)

Spawn costs for ground vehicles are intentionally low, repair costs are a reason but also used as an excuse (not all think off SL when it comes to in match actions), J-ing out and moving to another vehicle (or you might have been knocked out, from kill feeds it happens to A LOT of players before any aircraft spawn prior to helicopters) is low cost, and apart from those focused on k/d stats (but that is a them problem) any player can easily adapt (not just AA or Planes but ANY ground vehicle). Of course one vehicle lineup players can only field their single vehicle twice but that again is “consequence to action”. Yes, in this game there is consequence to your and every players action, other’s who you cannot control . This sort of “sit there and face smack planes” is the only reason I can think of SPAA not having higher SL/RP rewards currently. I presume that in the “stats” SPAA get to, overall, earn enough as is due to all the poor play by those flying and creating easy kills (the face smacking scenarios).


  • I don’t see the need for it (OP) and can alter how people play making some terrible passive at spawn situations. Solely for SPAA, as the OP focuses on, I feel it would just worsen the situation I always disliked of SPAA players sitting at spawn (and wondering why they are easy to clear with the right munition; we know where you are! (as opposed to “in field” SPAA who not everyone can as easily locate depending on settings)).
  • Aircraft respawn choices are already “balanced”. When you know it takes x time to RTB to rearm or J out you are fully aware of the consequence of taking such a vehicle in regards to “dead time”. Creating a “de-spawn” zone would probably see people abusing it (one, to intercept any player using it, two, aircraft using it to get out of a bad situation quickly - dependant on how such a system works). But currently I see it as doable (RTB).

We should also add fulton extraction device bro like metal gear solid 5 where we can balloon our tanks out of the battlefield maybe when certain conditions is met lol

One player doing it in a full game isn’t an issue. It’s what happens when you have several, and you’re already down half a team. And, at the end of the day, it’s time spent doing nothing. Just flying in a straight line, landing, taking off, repeat. Dunno about you, but I try to minimize the monotony in my gameplay as much as possible.

You can say that it’s the cost of playing CAS, but wouldn’t allowing them to despawn achieve roughly the same thing? You still delay the CAS, probably even more than allowing the rearm, you simply allow the player back on the ground faster. If the idea is to nerf CAS, then let’s nerf them by nerfing them, not by adding a monotonous commute to bore them on their way to and from the battlefield.

I usually do push up in SPAA, however, this requires an SPAA that can actually push. Many are unable to actually defend themselves against enemy tanks. For every Wirblewind and Gepard, there’s an M16, Shilka and Chaparral, who will achieve nothing more that suicide if they face off against almost any common tank at their tiers. Hell, I’ve been enjoying the Type 81 recently, and that thing is not only completely unable to defend itself, but also huge, and playing at a tier where hiding in concealment isn’t an option. Pushing any distance into the map is just massively increasing your chance of dying for little gain in that and others like it.

Even in the best case scenario, where you manage to support your team and push with them without them dying or you being flanked, you’re stuck in the proactive role I described, sitting around waiting for planes who may or may not show up. This is not fun nor rewarding gameplay. This is why I’m pushing for the option to get out of these passive gameplay roles and back into the game, be it out of a plane RTBing or an SPAA sitting around.

Tank RB is a war of attrition. Each player spawns with a limited number of resources (Crewslots and SP), and they have to use that limited resource carefully, in order to deplete the enemies resources before their own runs out. This is most obvious in the Battle gamemode, but even in others, the game often turns when players on one team start running out and leaving the game (Or leaving for other reasons, but that’s a seperate issue).

That being said, throwing away the tank you’re playing just for the oppertunity to use SPAA, only to throw that away when every aircraft in the AO is dead, is the opposite of good gameplay. Burning not only the SP but also the tank spawns (Assuming you have the standard 5ish crewslots and aren’t willing to burn backups in every average game you play) puts yourself at a substantial disadvantage if the game goes long, and for the slight advantage of less downtime? Why should players be punished so severely for just wanting to engage CAS targets proactively?

Easy solutions to that, either add AA to the zone or make it so that the zone doesn’t work if there’s an enemy aircraft within Xm distance, depending on which aspect is considered problematic. Ultimately, spawncamping aircraft and running down CAS who you catch in a vulnerable position on the map are already options in the current gamemode, adding a despawn zone isn’t likely to make either problem worse.

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It is all dependant on how such a mechanic were implemented. So a good idea to think of possible issues with such a zone existing.

Again, in theory the “costs” of using a plane is a consequence and so it is with too many using air at wrong times or used poorly. Due to the “team” metric of the game sadly “all doing things at the wrong time” is player choice. Of course some think and some don’t, it is just annoying you can’t control it of course.

I see the reasoning, and the reality of many games being short due to the epidemic of players just not enjoying the game they loaded up. So I do get the “lost time” part. But again low/mid AF turn around time is not too harsh. When a Pe-8 can rearm twice you know there is a lot of time (anecdotal from a few years back, two on my team managing few kills but mulitple sorties as no enemy spawned a plane to deny a low alt meme-bomber).

I’m busy right now so apologise for not responding to the next sections where I think you make good points even if we might disagree.

You aren’t wrong, but I’m going to take a quick dive into game design here to make a point, if you’ll indulge me.

Generally speaking, when you build a game, you want to make systems that reward “good” gameplay, and punish “bad” gameplay. This helps train players to engage in productive gameplay, and avoid gameplay that punishes them instead of rewarding them.

Generally speaking, spawning CAS is profitable, so players are encouraged to do it. But once they’ve dropped their payload, what does the game prompt them to do next? They basically have three options, lotiering, suiciding, and rearming.

Rearming is the most positive option. It conserves your SP and allows you to get back into that profitable CAS plane without any cost to the player. However, this is generally not the best move, either for game health but also tactically for the player. Game health wise, CAS strikes are already a quite annoying aspect of the game for many, allowing chain rearms increases the frequency of CAS strikes. This is a particular problem for already strong CAS that are already difficult to take down (A-6Es, A-4Es, Arados, AMXs, etc). Tactically, too many people in the air with too few on the ground risks losing all of their map control.

Loitering is the most neutral of these options. It is occasionally profitable, but this is usually counteracted by the death that’s more or less guaranteed. This is why it’s a somewhat common default for players, especially at tiers where SPAA is less of a threat.

Suiciding is the most negative option. You get saddled with a repair cost and lose access to that plane, while achieving nothing (well, nothing more than what you achieved with the CAS plane in the first place). Additionally, since you have to opt in to taking the punishment, it’s even less incentivised psychologically. This is despite this often technically being the soundest tactical move a player can make, notable when there’s a lack of players on the ground.

I hope you can see the issue with the way these systems are built. The most profitable (AKA encouraged) option is bad not only for game health, but also strategically. Meanwhile, the inverse is true for the most strategic option.

That’s why I’m pushing for a rearm zone. It aligns things so that the option that’s most encouraged gameplay wise is also the best choice strategically, and reduces the frequency of CAS slightly, while also removing the pointless commute. It’s win/win for everyone.

Planes can spawn from the void in mid air, fully loaded up with as many bombs as possible because we don’t need to take off anyways, moving at cruising speed… but being able to switch to SPAA in spawn is too much for some people.


Classic shooters like OG SWBF2 had this option on any command post. You could swap to any unit as needed on any objective under your team’s control.

I would say this is down to knowledge many players are unable to use a plane, and therefore no planes to kill planes, therefore many know there is a good chance of “easy kills”. The only reason spam is such a thing is over the years there are a lack of players willing to use such planes properly. In other words WT RBGF only works when players are willing; on the whole they appear not to be (since trapped in the GRIND of WT).

So dependant on CAS chosen they can help stop the enemy using their own CAS after they dropped/finished attacking ground. They can land, which takes in most BRs minimal time. A suicide is SL cost plus loss of 100 tickets (I’ve seen games lost like this as tanks/planes waste themselves for quick action but actually cost so much ticket drain they lose the match = less SL/RP for all). So my main disagreement is that I believe the rearming/Land to move to ground is the best move, from the above, yet I do not see it as “bad for game health” from the position that a plane generally is only as threatening as a team lets them become. A CAS rearming is easy prey for CAP for the most part, just in reality players do odd stuff and so many times you can see air from both sides ignore one another for one ground kill (less SL/RP btw - and generalising planes, not picking heavy loadout/multidrop aircraft).

So I am not sure why you believe that frequency would be less with an air rearm point. Also, dependent on mechanic, could this create a situation of baiting at these points; drag a anti-air plane to the rearm spot, this CAP is now out of action effectively, new player spawns a CAS and has no threat from the baited CAP?

Respawns in air would not stop the frequency of CAS, it could make it even easier to rearm and attack the enemy, increasing any issue players have with CAS. Again dependent on how the mechanic were introduced.

I do not believe the game pushes to what one should do as “incentives” are very much personal. The best option is to land and rearm, this is while under the threat of enemy taken you out during sorties/landing/returning to battle. “Loitering” is more for cannon attacks or to move to a CAP role, and IF enemy CAS is so likely it is the right choice, IF enemy CAS is not as likely as people mention then sure it could be a waste. And suicide is THE main way I see players use planes (intentionally is not always clear, compression is a bugger for those unaware of their craft), which is to me the worst and most foolish use of an asset. Unless 1 minute TikTok games is what the player base has moved to then who actually cares about anything more than bangs and explosions?!

To the actual topic: I still do not like the idea of “hanging around spawn” on the ground; for the area to provide a new respawn mechanic I get the feeling a lot would use it and would make for an even more passive mode of people sticking to spawn (and then moaning CAS or Arti types keep spamming the spawn knowing all the players just sitting their as it often happens now). It was a pet peeve of mine and another nail in the coffin of WT in my mind. I have no issue with the ability to change a vehicle, but the mechanic and way it would be at spawn just feels like it would create its own set of issues. And if there are not a few dead team mates before CAS starts (not every match is CAS in 1 minute, or even CAS with a pilot with a brain) that made the “choice” to adapt to the battle then it all boils down to consequences in a team environment (of course the reality is it is just TDM with less T and the actual focus being on Event/Grind/Progress Buzz; the actual gameplay really comes second due to the pressure on players (dopemine hit).

Truth be told “good gameplay” is not the centre of GFRB. Quick Yolo Bang Bang is the direction the game took since the opening up of RB by lowering all SP costs (as now it is easy to respawn a few times, unlike before, and yet people think that they are somehow limited with choice as the matches evolve). All the time I see forum discussions about the mode I remember that most matches/players you meet are like 32 headless chickens doing their own thing (though more likely that own thing is bundle face first into the enemy on one tiny part of the map as seems the most “fun” place).

No one has put forward the point of view you appear to be criticising:

Unless you mean Gaijin, who no one has asked yet.

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I didn’t account for CAP planes in my original post, not because people can’t fly, but because that’s a role that’s even less well thought out than SPAA.

CAP planes are entirely passive to the game on the ground. They project no map control, they cannot cap points, they ultimately cannot contribute outside of shooting down CAS. Even the most ineffectual SPAAs in AT capacity can rush points, track people, scout and/or be a distraction if the time comes. CAP planes can attempt to strafe out targets to spot/track/disable, but that makes them vulnerable to SPAA, and also throws away their energy and surprise against an enemy CAS plane.

Additionally, while SPAA is dirt cheap to spawn, CAP planes often aren’t much cheaper than CAS and thus puts you at a severe SP shortage if you are unable to engage CAS planes. It’s also not something a team that’s already running low on SP can whip out if the situation demands it, the way SPAAs can be.

Your entire game impact is in being able to take out CAS planes, and accordingly your entire game impact is predicated on their being enemy CAS to shoot down. Additionally, in order to minimize the game impact of your CAS targets, you have to intercept them before they get to the battlefield, leading very naturally into spawncamping, which breeds toxicity.

All summed up, this puts CAP into a very weird role that Gaijin clearly hasn’t thought out very well. It’s game impact can either be hilariously huge, able to cause massive SP loses to the enemy team if they can down their CAS before they drop (With added toxicity from spawncamping, most likely), or it can be the same as going AFK. It has the exact same problems as proactive SPAAs but amplified.

This is assuming the zone is next to the battlefield. It also assumes the CAP plane somehow manages to burn all it’s energy in a straight line chase and is unable to conserve that energy for a new target.

That’s why I’m considering an increasing SP cost for each sortie. Depends on how it plays out. Either way, it takes them out of the skies and puts them back on the ground for at least one more life (More if they rush in and suicide before the rearm timer is finished), as opposed to now where they are free to continue to shuttle between the airfield and the map.

I’m not 100% certain of the impact these changes will have, obviously. Even if these changes somehow got Gaijin’s interest, I’d want it tested in real matches before it made it to the live server. I just think the potential upsides in terms of cutting back on passively sitting around (or flying around, as the case may be) is worth looking into.

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They already implemented this feature for Nuke plane in last update, so hopefully, they could do something similar for SPAAs.