Leopard 1A5 should be buffed like should be given a better engine.
You can pen it frontally with normal ammo and use APCR if You struggle to go for weakspots with Tiger II H, KV-220 doesn’t have any other ammo.
I will make it easier for You, Jagdpanther that is on 6.3.\
The only reason KV-220 is used at 6.0 SQB is because it doesn’t have to face anything above 6.0.
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Lmao, as if you absolutely need APCR to kill Tiger II from the front:
Besides, are you also suggesting the Jumbo 75 should go down to 5.3 because in a 0.7 uptier, it can face the jagdpanther?
It’s almost like there are 6.3s that are just as good, if not better.
You can say the same with any other tank.
“The only reason IS-3 is used at 7.3 SQB is because it doesn’t have to face anything above 7.3.”
“The only reason the Jumbo 76mm is used at 6.3 SQB is because it doesn’t have to face anything above 6.3.”
“The only reason the Tiger II H is used at 6.7 SQB is because it doesn’t have to face anything above 6.7.”
Should we put in to the test when I use Tiger II H and You KV-220?
Why not? Can’t wait to hear from You supporting the change for KV-220 as it is only 0.3 uptier.
The difference is all this vehicles can actually do something and enemy doesn’t have to be braindead.
What would be the point?
You are good player and the Tiger II H is 0.7 BRs higher than the KV-220 because it’s better.
The KV-220 should lose more often than win against the Tiger II H assuming both players are equally as skilled.
Because these vehicles were too oppressive when all they faced were tanks that they could always penetrate frontally.
The Churchill VII is the new bully at 4.7 (now that it has access to M61 shot) – basically the Jumbo at 4.7 because it can practically kill everything (apart from things like the VK 3002 at long range) it sees without much issue.
You don’t have to engage tanks frontally. Just because these are heavy tanks doesn’t mean you have to be on the front lines. I flank with the Jumbo 75 / 76 against Jagdpanthers / IS-3s and I’m fine with having to do that.
Meanwhile, in a full downtier, these tanks are a menace to deal with. Imagine moving them even lower.
Do you really think 4.7s should be seeing the KV-220, or 4.3s seeing the Jumbo 75 again?
The point is that You won’t make that shot in normal game occurance if one is paying attention.
KV-220 has issues with 0.3 uptier, and if it was at 5.7 it would still struggle against 6.3 and 6.7 as it is today.
With that logic BT-5 can be at 12.7 as it can pen leopard from side.
It can still kill it frontally.
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As it should be?
Why should a 6.0 heavy (of that caliber) have no trouble frontally engaging 0.7 BR higher heavies?
And to be honest, with how well Boozer has been doing in the Tiger II H (SLA), I think they should’ve already moved it up to 7.0.
If we’re going that route, the KV-8 struggles against tanks frontally at its own BR. Should it go down to 3.3 or even 2.7?
You are taking it to an extreme and trying to say that is my point. The point is that you are not the top dog when you get uptiered by 0.7 - 1.0, so don’t expect to be able to win every fight fairly, especially not in a 1v1 situation.
A KV-220 can beat an average Tiger II player much more easily than a BT-5 against an average Leopard player.
Most 4.7s (besides a few) cannot kill an angled KV-220. They’d only be able to breech it.
It’s simple, like the 75 jumbo and other heavies of that kind, DONT USE IT IN THOSE SITUATIONS.
Not every heavy can be uptier proof, for some of they go lower to be uptier proof then they’re oppressive in down tiers.
The actual solution is variable br’s but gaijin is unlikely to do that. So in the mean time as long as the tank is still usable in most situations, it’s fine where it is.
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Some heavies have good guns (for their BR) and mediocre armour (such as the KV-122, IS-2, T34, T1E1), some heavies have crappier guns and very good armour (such as the Jumbo 75, T26E5, KV-220, KV-8, KV-1E/B, etc).
The reason why T26E5 and T26E1 are at the same BR is because one sacrifices armour for a better gun, while the other sacrifices a good gun for better armour. I think that’s fair, even if T26E5 fares worse in uptiers, its gun is good enough in downtiers, so it fares better in downtiers.
I think that’s a reasonable trade-off, and is why they are the same BR as each other.
Same goes for those other types of heavies.
The problem is that the Leo A1A1 is quite a lot better than a T-62, M60A1 RISE (p) or Chieftain Mk.5.
Armour also doesn’t matter too much given that most vehicles lolpen others without much issue, at which point mobility matters more, and the Leopard A1A1 is still a lot more mobile than the aforementioned peers at 8.7.
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The only outliers in this list are the german T-34 and the IT-1. Everything else is stupid AT BEST. At worst (BMPT), they’re actively ruining BR brackets. (or were when the video was made) Additionally, Spookston uses these naming schemes across ALL of his (modern-ish) videos. Thumbnail styles too. You’re grasping at straws here
hot take: move the Tiger 2s back to 7.0
5.7 as a BR Bracket literally does not exist right now because the tiger 2s (soyjak point tanks) are 6.7 (as well as the Churchill VII getting APHE but you’re getting way more uptiers than downtiers). American 6.7 is probably not helping much either but the Tiger 2 is the main culprit here. Too many German players.
This is not unique to the KV-220. KVs in general are really annoying to pen when angled at 4.7. The 17 pounder struggles to do it for godsake.
ya no.
the tiger 2h is one of the better 6.7, but not 7.0 good, now if you depress that br section by moving most 6.7 heavies and their corresponding mediums, then thats fine, because remember before the engine nerf the tiger 2h ONLY upside is the gun and average mobility and average armour, now its just the great gun and average armour, and thats comparing it to other 6.7s including the is2.
also this is forgetting that moving the tiger 2h, will kill that br and likely have a cascading affect for the german teams around this br section, because well, germany doesnt really have a 6.3 lineup, the tiger 2h is carrying the 6.7 and without it be the worse 6.7 lineup of any nation (because russia is currently being carried by the monster that is the su-122-54), 7.0 just doesnt exist outside of rare removed vehicles that hasnt been accessible for like a decade and 7.3 is pretty much non existent meaning germany would have a br gap from 6.0, to 7.7/8.0 ya that will likely kill off what’s left of the 8.0 and 9.3 competency that germany is still holding on for dear life atm.
also i just remembered, the tiger 2h was never 7.0 to begin with.
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As it stands right now, NOBODY can play 5.7. I’m not making a balance argument, I’m making a “let this BR exist again” argument.
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Even if only a few shatter the issue is the reload is so long you really notice every time it does. Imagine you already had to wait for a reload before firing, after shattering that’s now 24 seconds of uselessness.
ya still doesnt fix the problem, youre just moving it around, also if by this logic then it wouldve been a thing for a much longer time, like the start of the game time, which it hasnt, also of the 5.7 lineups, only china struggles, because they dont really have a lineup in the first place,
also why are you so up and up about 5.7, only the US and russia really have anything at this br in the first place, and ironically after looking at the win rates for 5.7 the only nation that is sub 47%, is germany, with a 45, funny enough japan is the one outlier having the only win rate above 50%, with everyone else at 47 or 48
T-62, Rise (P), and Chieftain Mk.5 I can understand, though the Magach 6B, Turm III, Object 122, and (maybe) the Object 140 are all arguably just as good as it.
I agree when it comes to dealing with other MBTs, but the Leopard A1A1 definitely struggles more against SPAA like the XM246, Gepard, Type 87, and autocannon lights (like the BMP-2 and XM800T) than more well-armoured MBTs like the T-62s and Magach 6Bs.
Armor does matter as it protects them from auto cannons and for example the M60A1 RISE (p) when I fight against it can tank a lot of missiles even tandem ones.
I think a 6.7 sec reload and a br of 6.0 is a good balance.
6.0 already kills it because every match is either 6.7 or 7.0 in which it’s cannon it’s almost useless vs the spammed:
T26E5, T29, T34, Tiger II, etc etc.
Btw.
My angle is higher than the image that you quoted, because I went to commander view, not my gunner view, and my gunner view is slightly more left than my commander view when I died.
T-34 is better in mobility, has decent armor, and actually good survivability, because the commanders coffee cup doesn’t explode and cook-off the ammo like in the KV-220 lol.
Seriously though… given the options at 6.0 Russia, the T-V (panther) is a better option overall.
- more mobility
- better turret traverse
- smoke grenades
- 75mm with more pen, less HE. (Meaning you kill higher br tanks)
- can blend in with the enemy team if they’re german.
This is why I told Ion and others armor alone cannot be the br controlling factor, as yes the Kv-220 is a jack of trades, but its weak in everything but armor.
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Ho Ri is OP anyways. Pretty much everything has a hard time facing it.
I killed 2 mauses with a T26e5’s APCR once lol. They were pissed.
Also, I’d like to mention the Black Prince as another 6.0 which Imho is better than the 220 because of its APDS, and smokes, with a very short reload.