Ground SB has to be more immersive

Grüß Gott,

for years there have been calls from Sim players to improve and refine things in Sim. I’m not saying otherwise. I want things that Gaijin has very lovelessly designed to be improved.
I don’t want a second HLL or Arma, but I don’t want a second RB either. it’s just about improving unloved things in Sim. I’ll give you another example: the Bomber Gunner in Sim. For 9 years players have been waiting for other solutions for Sim.

Sim doesn’t have to become a hardcore milsim. and there is no rule that a combat game has to be implemented half-assed and sloppy. there are always things to improve and embellish.

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I’m all for it, but it would be a long overhaul for gaijin to undertake.

Ground Sim is not popular just because you cant play what you want at any given time.

If all rotations were preset at all times and people could grind what they want to grind at any given moment, it would be different story. Now you have to wait for your rotation to show up.

Look at Air Sim. You can find full lobbies at peak times, just because players can play what they want to play without restrictions.

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Yes and no. The disadvantage is you get some brackets with no lobbies at all and some brackets where you may only get 2v2 lobbies which can be a bit dull… and then you get other brackets with 10 nearly full lobbies.

So there is strengths and weaknesses to both lobby types.

The other advantage of the GSB set up is that Gaijin get a LOT more control over balance

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yes the sim ground lineups could run in parallel

Grüß Gott!

It would be insanely stupid that idea.

And they will waiting another 9 Years bc bombers are so unpopular, bc of the fact that they havent a real porpuse in ARB. In ASB they have, but the majority dont want/cant play ASB. So they wont do anything about this, same as their cockpits they look like crap.

But it is a vehicle combat game. As I said, people who complain about camera settings and it would be cool if we could have 1st person view etc. This isnt the place for it and it would be also pretty crap to play that way imho.

Thats for sure, but they have to start with it. Longer they wait, longer it will loose players bc of the fact, that nothing improves…

In fact it is one of the major issues what players have. And Im not talking about the hardcore sim players who wants to make GSB a Milsim tank mode. Im talking about the majority of casual player who want to experience a bit of a harder/realistic mode where the player cant look around corners.

As I mentioned earlier.

Yeah, but I really have to say that I dislike it in some cases, bc it leads the player to always be top tier and always take the meta planes. And if some of the other players want to spade for example the Me262s and have to face Meteors which outturns you, outspeed you and have more ammo than you and can better climb that you, unless you use the rocket booster, then you cant really try to spade that thing. You get destroyed all the time. And thats not the only plane that suffers quite a lot.

Yes thats true, but also not. If you watch todays rotation 8_2 then you will see some major problems:
The Russians only pick IS6, IS4M, IS3, Su100P, M53/59, and the T54s. It isnt that crapiest lineup for them, but on the other hand the chinese only can choose from Type62(which is good imo), Type63I, M41A3, Obj 211(5.0 PT76), Su100 thats all. On the other side There is French with AMX50, lorraine40t, char 25t, ebr´63. Then germany with DF105, m48A2, m47G, or Italy with the best m47 ingame with the 105mm APDS, AUBL, C13, R3T106, Sweden with USH, Brits with FV4202, Conqueror, Caernarvon, Conway, Centurions.

And tomorrow the 10_2 rotation begins, the most unbalanced rotation Ive ever saw. T90A, ZTZ99II&III, ZLT11, Z19E, 2S25M, 2S38(wich belongs to 11.3 imo), Object 292(which belongs to 12.0 imo with more pen then a 2A7V), BMP2M, T72M2 Moderna, T80s, Khrizantema, 2S6, Mi35M.

These are only two Rotation lists, there are more. So yeah they should have more control over balance but they dont do anything. They put the Obj292 in that lineup bc its 10.0 but has more pen then 11.7 tanks. That unfair.

(And yeah I know that the other nations also have their powerhouses, but when you want to grind 9.0-9.3 and you have to face in your stock rooikat MTTD a T90A then you only want to delete the game.

Or chinese/russian tanks without thermals facing CV 90105 and AGS while the top REDFOR tank is T-64A, ah yes, that rotation is also very great.

Yep. SB would be my main Ground mode if it had normal matchmaking instead of these presets. We even tested this a couple years back and it was a ton of fun, then… nothing. :(

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Grüß Gott,


Thought police I see.

You called everyone out (except for Alvis? That’s a hot take). Then proposed your own ideas and said everyone else’s was crap.

I see you are the objective one here haha…

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I remember this vote for it, I think it was overall rejected but not publicized. What was appalling was the amount of bullying sim players were doing about this vote. Huge negative about using normal MM in sim was the BRs were even worse than those of AB/RB.


True it was tested but Sim community said in majority they do not want sim to be turned more into RB with historical match maker. This is mainly why change did not go through. Because Gajin proposed to just go back to same system as RB matchmaking instead of rotations.

Both systems are quite flawed. Current rotation system encourages people to use only meta or top of the bracket vehicles. While RB matchmaker is all over the place when it comes to balancing.


no, it was schizophrenia.

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no, it’s just about improvements. not about hardcore measures. people also want better graphics, realistic sound…
so and so just wants a little more tank feeling. so that sim feels better. thats all. AB and RB already exist.

I also called him out. He just not brought up as many weird ideas to “improve” GSB. Here we cant really speak about “improvement” bc you guys spoke about interiors when even if bombers there arent any. And about Tanks movement should be “improved” and the gun handling.
Dont get me wrong, I like the idea of working on Gun handling bc if we watch history the Sherman 75mm and 76mm also the D5T, Russian 125mm etc arent the most accurate bc theyve gone for quantity not for quality, even now with T80BVM, T72B3, etc. It needed for example 5 T72B to encounter 1 Leopard 2A4.
So making Guns less accurate would be a cool addition.

I said indeed that your ideas for a “Vehicle Combat Game” where you operate a whole tank with not historical accurate Engines, Turret rotations, gun handlings, there arent the bad/problem sides of the tanks. For this specific game I said, that your ideas are bad for the actual mode.
If you would spin that further and you implement for example your idea @Calerid with the interior then you have to overhaul the whole camera for GSB. It would be either something like the “drivermode” like a function so you could press a button and you are inside of your tanks or it would be changed so that the base perspective is inside your tank and when you want to use your binos, you have to climb out of the hatch and if your commander dies, you cant use your binos anymore and you are forced to only use your gunner optics.
This “improvement” alone would sooo much work, especially bc graphic designs are the most difficult thing in game development. and I guarantee that the majority would say either way ok cool feature but I want my old perspective back.
But would YOU prefer this over the current perspective ? Do you think that the majority even new players who wants to try out GSB would prefer that ?
Your idea is coupled with @Lieutenant_Camel idea in my example.

The other Idea from @DerGrafVonZahl for example, more realistic movement and gun handling sounds on paper great, but how would it fit in the GAME, bc in all scenarios this isnt a Simulation, its a Game for casuals and Gaijin wants to attract more casuals to improve their earnings. So we have to talk about would it fit in the game, not speak about it would be cool to feel more “tank”.
And when we talk about historical accuracy, then we have to implement the whole accuracy(the downs and the ups) Like spontaniously engine fire, gear breakdowns, chances to die or get injured to early autoloader mechanism, etc. Also to the planes and helis.
It would be so much for gaijin to do and implement even if we are speaking about an ongoing process.

My ideas arent as realistic as yours, right. But they arent more likely “improve” GSB imho and from the peoples perspective what you hear a lot, then makeing GSB more Simulator then it is now.

I would love this idea, would play SB more than RB if this was set up this way.

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No. They would not. Everyone would play either top tier, 11_2 or their premium tier which was 9_2 but now has shifted to 10_2. It would just make getting a game in the early Cold War brackets even more impossible. 8_2 and 8_2_2 would be effectively dead if you didn’t have to play them at least once a week.

You underestimate veterans and players who are bored out with same crappy RB we had for god knows how long and looking for extra challange and some fresh experience.

Myself included. If all rotations were present I would not touch RB with 10 feet pole. I already do not play AirRB unless I got like 1-2 modules left to spade.

it is a flight sim though… why are tanks special? if it’s for casuals, make it like naval and delete SIM. Simulators are not for casuals. It doesn’t need mass appeal, that’s what AB and RB are for.

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No. You underestimate how this actually works, probably because you never played Sim before the change to a rotating bracket.

Absolute correct if you just look on the perspective how it is right now. But if the people see that Sim getting changed they more likely will play Sim again and so they are more players to fill the brackets. So if they would change that, then you would be able maybe not right at the first but slowly the playerbase would increase and then you will be able normaly those brackets.

No it isnt. It started as a Arcade Air Combat Vehicle Game.

Every vehicle is special on their own part. Balance reason changes are different from planes to tanks. for example.

Not only for casuals, but those who really are into realistic simulations etc, are in my opinion the little part of the game. The majority only want to experience a realistic vehicle combat game and if its a bit harder its already perfect. Bc those who really want to experience the whole tank crew feeling, then they play different games like Squad44 where the dmg model is good compared to WT and you only take part as a specific Crewmember.

Absolute dumb answer.

Yes and no. For Simulator players every beginner is a casual in the most cases.

Absolute wrong! So in your case you want a real Simulator for tanks, even if there would be around the world only 300 people who is interested in this for example (I know there are more than 300 people) so you wouldnt be able to find a single match within the first 40 minutes(it depends where you living). So you would prefer that ? Then Gaijin should do a fully custom lobby maker, where you can do every single setting like your preferation. So you and the other 300 people would be happy.

Because I for example dont want to play realistic and I dont want to play Arcade. I like the camera perspective in Sim how it is rn. I like the gunner sights as it is. The only thing I dont like, are those what I mentioned in my 3 pages long post from early this day. And you want to force me to play GRB bc GSB should be a real Simulation?

I mean Simulator is the wrong name for the mode I mentioned it too.

Here I mentioned it. Maybe doing a 4th mode and call it Simulator, where it is a real Simulation.