Gerpard round capacity

[AspectOfTheRAGE]

DM 33 FAPDS weighs 396g (298g penetrator mass), the muzzle velocity was 1440m/s (±5m/s). The sabot itself was made out of plastic, the bottom of the sabot aluminium. The drive-band was made out of plastic.

DM 11 A1 (MSD-042) and DM 13 A1 (PLD-044) were both 550g, MV = 1175m/s (±5m/s)

DM 23 APDS-T (TLD-038) was 380g (294g tungsten penetrator), sabot was made out of plastic, bottom of the sabot out of aluminium and idk about the drive-band, would have to check my brochures again if they list it. MV was 1385m/s (±5m/s)

Maximum Gas Pressure is the same for all types listed above at 383MPa.

[Thodin]

@AspectOfTheRAGE

Only Gepard 1 A2 should have full belts of sub-calibre ammunition (DM 33 FAPDS); For the others, it’s nearing pure fiction.

Thats true, Gepard 1A2 just used this as main AA ammunition. HEI and Full AP was not longer in use by then. Just wounder where this is ingame. There’s even an old Bundeswehr reel of the A2 upgrade showing Gepards use FAPDS main belt vs spaced armor test arrays and they pen quite alot plates in a row. Also the franglible part seemingly did alot secondary fragmentation damage, while the bulk penetrator continued to pen through this spaced array. Would be nice to have ingame. Gepard A2 could be the best gun SPAA in WT, with just very little less pen than common APDS, but more fragmentation cause of the frangible part of the shell. The Gepard 1A2 ingame is somehow not real with just its old ammo loadout. FAPDS (more speed, more range etc.) was the main point of the whole upgrade, but its not ingame^^

Thats also interesting. Footage of Gepard target practice using HEI-T. Detonation power and incidary effect look devastating. Also ask myself wheter ingame HEI-T should have bit more pen?

Same source. Old image (1993) from Gepard target practice vs. old dummy tank. Also HEI-T. This tank was indeed set ablaze. Wounder the anti tank/ OP effect should be higher as well. I could imagine a live tank would now be out of action with that nasty fire.

[AspectOfTheRAGE]

Well theres another thing to note:
Around 1985-1986 DM 31 HE-T was introduced to replace DM 13 A1 APHEI-T and DM 21 HEI (Identical to DM 11 A1 HEI but with indent above drive-band), ofc existing stocks of the latter two were used for a while after but you get the idea.
So tests from 1993 most likely show the use of DM 31

While DM 11 A1/DM 21 and DM 13 A1 were made by Oerlikon DM 31 was made by Diehl - It’s a base-fuzed HE-T shell, with an incendiary filler inside the ballistic cap (16g) and another 45g Hexal explosive charge within the shell body.

You can probably imagine why it was more consistent in dealing damage to whatever struck;
The incendiary mixture would ignite even without penetration and would thus have an effect even if e.g. the fuze failed and would allow dealing damage to both the outside surface, aswell as the inside of the struck target.

Solely due to its shape and layout,I’d argue it probably pens less than DM 13 A1 APHEI-T (40mm RHA @ 1000m, 90°).

Nammo offers a HEI/SD round for the 35mm and lists 40mm RHA penetration at 100m, so it could very well be around that figure.

35 mm APHEI-T DM 13 A1, PLD-044

35 mm HE-T DM 31

Aside from the difference in filler mass (45g vs 22g), I think the shape of the shell-body should show why I believe that DM 31 would likely pen less than DM 13 A1.

Spoiler: Some more pictures of DM 31 HE-T

As for the FAPDS penetration:
I dont have exact numbers for DM 33, I do know however that the first plate penetration was almost on par with DM 23 APDS-T (the higher MV [1440m/s vs 1385m/s likely contributed to that), naturally - due to the frangible core, the subsequent plate pentration was lower as the core broke apart.

Here is a picture of the target array used for FAPDS;

I have the exact composition saved somewhere, I’ll add it when I find it.

This picture here shows just how devastating the frangible effect is; (The side shown is the exit-side, remeber that the core is <27mm in diameter)

Edit (I stopped counting at 4):
These are some of the standard targets for the base-fuzed HEI (Type SSD, from Oerlikon, i.e. not DM 31) and Oerlikons APFIDS (TSD-055, later: PMD 055).
Note: DM 33 FAPDS was made by NWM De Kruithoorn and Rheinmetall.

APFIDS = Armour Piercing Frangible Incendiary Discarding Sabot

Spoiler: Oerlikon Standard Targets with similar composition for TSD-055 APFIDS (1987)

Alright, that should be everything now, hopefully no more edits haha

[Schindibee]

Images from some demo plates pierced by 35mm Oerlikons took in 2016, but sadly it was not mentioned what exact type of ammo that was…

[AspectOfTheRAGE]

They look familiar tbh, I think they’re in one of the NDIA presentations from either Oerlikon/RWM or TNO, I’ll have a look if I can find it.

Edit: Even though its from 2002, I’d argue that its likely the same projectile used;

buckley.pdf

35x228 ABM/KETF (impact mode)

30x173 ABM/KETF (impact mode)

Spoiler: Full pages w/ the images above

Although it should be noted that the time (2016) and the small impact hole in the first 3 plates make it possible to be FAPDS, since that has a very similar damage “picture”.

2016 is also when Gepard 1 A2 (which used FAPDS) was removed from BW service, thus not making it entirely impossible to show FAPDS. (Its actually very likely to be now that I look at it again)

[Soviet_onion11]

Barrel wear and tear is not a feature of this game, otherwise the Gepard would only be able to fire 2 full canisters of ammo before the accuracy would be affected

[Zitrone3_2]

By that argument, please give all auto canons their theoretical max fire rate

[F16XLWT]

I think it also wears down on the cannons since they fire at a higher velocity than HE filled or regular AP rounds

[Soviet_onion11]

I’m not against it. why do you think I’m campaigning to give the Gepard full APDS belts?

[Soviet_onion11]

there is also the fact that Ukraine is using Gepards behind the front lines to defend against drone attacks with proxy fuse HE-T, i do not know what variant or modifications they have added but i think the fact that they are using them is argument enough that it should be added.