Ah yes, thats it. Thanks!
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Since y’all probably know a lot more than me… Is it a good time investment to grind the JP tech tree?
I’ve got a pretty much full opposite experience with the Chinese tech tree since i grinded all of it. Honestly there are different options in terms of what i could grind to get this “opposite” view but the two main nations that pop in my mind are US and JP… but due to the absolute meatgrinder of a tech tree (in terms of time) that the US tech tree is i guess JP would be a better option. The question though would be is it worth it? As in how do the JP F-15s compare to the US ones and how many more additions to toptier can we get?
Also tips on which planes to go for and which ones to “avoid” are more than welcome, i could also use tips for ground vehicles but that goes off topic…
TL;DR
Japan’s tech tree is unique and very fun, especially at the top tier, but it faces issues with BR placements, armor, missile performance, and lacks sufficient CAS, SPAA, and light tanks at high levels. Potential improvements could come with new additions or a subtree if Gaijin gives it more attention. I haven’t regretted grinding Japan; if I were to start again, I would play Japan first.
Long explanation
In terms of air, Japan is rather unique up until the Cold War, where options drop significantly. If you are looking for top-tier planes, the F-16AJ is a lot of fun (with some amazing camos) and will be followed up with the F-2A or F-2B, which could come with some unique capabilities and AESA. The F-15J and J(M) are also good with AAM-3 (a better AIM-9M), but in terms of ARH, they will basically stay the same as America. Gaijin has done a rather poor job with the AAM-4, and in most situations, it is worse than the AIM-120B, at least it was the last time I tested it.
Generally, the F-15J and J(M) are very similar to their US versions. They have the AAM-3, which is essentially an AIM-9M with better G-load performance. Other than that, they are about the same. The F-15J(M) does have the AAM-4, but as mentioned, the AIM-120B is usually more effective. There is a more advanced version (AAM-4B) that could come with either the F-2A/B or a later F-15J, but I have little hope for the AAM-4B being any better than the AAM-4. A subtree that could add the F-16 or JAS-39 would be beneficial, especially for CAS.
In terms of ground, Japan is very, very different from most other nations. They usually have very little armor with rather okay mobility and firepower compared to most other nations. At top tier, they are very fun (and very scary if played right). The Type 90s have insane mobility and reload, allowing you to get away with some daring plays. Type 10s are similar with better firepower, reverse speed, and optics. The issue with them is the lackluster armor; most shots to the turret will penetrate, and you have virtually no side armor. Autocannons have no issue killing you in most situations.
There is little future for new tanks after the Type 10s unless Gaijin adds a subtree (which seems likely). If so, it would freshen up the Japanese top tier in general. Potential additions range from the 2RI/2SG to T-84 Oplots, F-16s, and JAS-39s. It’s in a situation where it could be much better than it currently is if Gaijin gave it more attention. But regardless of the current and future, it is still a VERY fun tech tree.
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Thanks for the detailed explanation, i really appreciate it.
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If you are going to gun for top tier, I would recommend getting the Type 16s. They are very fun, very fast, and have good optics just be aware of M735. The Type 81C is also fun for destroying CAS, but it’s far from its heyday when it slaped 9.0 planes out of the sky. :D
Regarding subtrees, the most likely candidates are Thailand, Singapore, Indonesia, or South Korea. Each of these countries would add a lot of unique stuff, especially Thailand with their T-84 Oplot.
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Yeah it would be pretty fun to collect the various VT-4 versions, i’m looking forward to the Type 16s since i’ve found them multiple times in my battles and they seem fun.
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I get my first nuke with type16 when M735 already got nerf, still a fun tank just need some skill and luck…
and if no more powerful round I’m already not play Type16 anymore when I play 12.0 or above BR, when it meet tanks like leo2a7 or T90M/T80BVM it really not pen most time, sad :(
Quick question, will us Japan mains ever see something like the JNAAM for our F35s?
I mean, aside from the AIM-260 or some domestically made Japanese missile if it ever comes to fruition quick enough, I don’t know whether Japan can still be viable in the future
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I can see JNAAM being added for the F-35 for the sake of being both built and tested and intended for use on the F-35, the same would also go for Britain.
There could be Japanese F-X 5th gen designs that would fall under unfinished prototype rules and give Japan their F-22 equivalents.
Spoiler
Overview of the various designs
23DMU; Basically an upscaled ATD-X/X-2. It can be compared to an F-22 in concept, though it is smaller, carries two less internal MRAAMs, has a delta wing and has secondary side facing radar arrays. It also uses 3D TVC rather than the F-22s 2D TVC.
24DMU; An alternate design to the 23DMU. This one is closer to a YF-23 in design, with the same internal weapons capacity as the 23DMU, though the weapons bays are now placed in tandem, rather than side by side. It retains the secondary radar arrays and TVC of the 23DMU, but has a more trapezoidal wing.
25DMU; Big redesign, both figuratively and literally. This type is larger than the initial ones and now carries 6 MRAAMs internally. This one is also the first of these to incorporate a cannon.
26DMU; Update of 25DMU design, changing control surfaces and wing.
These would carry existing AAM-5/5B and AAM-4B, but also ducted AAM-4 missiles.
Some of the built components including a center fuselage section and main weapons bays for 25/26DMU (they only differ by the wings and control surfaces), XF9-1 engines and XVN3-1 thrust vectoring system, as well as radar, here fitted to an XF-2 for testing.
And of course there is also the ongoing 6th gen F-X, or GCAP.
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Development of JNAAM has been halted, because Britain’s collaboration with Japan violated the rules it had when developing Meteor with other European countries. Yes, JNAAM had the finished product, but never launched it. Japan will develop new missiles for GCAP.
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Which is kind of what I’m getting at here. Having been built and specifically intended for the F-35 I can see it added as “unfinished prototype”, in the same way as the Yak-141 received intended armaments and IRST which weren’t actually fitted on the aircraft.
Also there are ducted versions of the AAM-4 developed before JNAAM that could be added as well, though I believe those used the initial AAM-4 seeker and I’m not sure if there was a version with AAM-4B AESA. This wouldn’t have been intended for F-35 though, rather F-X 5th gen and maybe existing F-15Js and F-2s.
Spoiler
Ground launch test for ducted AAM-4
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There is the interesting news about it
In June 2024 there was video from parliament where it was discussed some projects and one of them - JNAAM
And in 21 of August, the new budget was published and there was point: Development of next-generation medium-range air-to-air guided missile to be mounted on next-generation fighter aircraft jointly developed by Japan, the UK and Italy
So in fact it looks like JNAAM project was revived
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To speculate; in the future when the F35 eventually arrives, we’re likely gonna receive 3 different kinds of missiles to choose from for Japan and the UK, right?
Also @skultew1234, if that’s for the next-gen fighter, I’m curious to know what should be the plan for specifically Japan with the F35B? Since F15Js and F35As will be the tip of the spear in most operations until the next-gen fighter is produced
Good heavens what is that cable management!
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It would sure be amazing if we can get it. Let’s just hope unfinished 5th generation prototypes aren’t a redline
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Did the prototypes actually exist, flew and were armed?
Yes and no, depending on how you see it…
They existed specifically in the form of various components being built, as well as a shared prototype for practical tests.
The ATD-X/X-2 did flight tests for the project, while other components such as engines, weapons bays, radar or even structural designs were prototyped separately and specific to the respective design of the time.
Spoiler
ATD-X/X-2 prototype for flight tests
Full scale model for RAM and RCS testing
XF9-1 engine
XVN3-1 TVC
Center fuselage
Weapons bay
Radar
As for being armed, the armament for the most part existed, though the ducted AAM-4 was only prototyped itself, also never entering service. The weapons bays for the armament were also tested.
Spoiler
Ducted AAM-4 during testing
So basically they were built, flown and armed, but all of this in many parts rather than full on complete aircraft.
I’d still see aircraft like these as necessary though in the future, and not only for Japan. Otherwise the top ranks will end up rather stale with endless F-35 vs F-35.
Since these are “unfinished prototypes” by definition of having vehicle specific parts completed, these fall under the same category as (for example) the Yak-141 does, but fill a more important role in the context of the game.
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Ah that’s really interesting. But yeah it does feel like it has more chances to become reality in war thunder since it did go through a decent amount of testing.
Honestly the unappealing factor of nations that aren’t US, China and USSR is that everybody will eventually have F-35s and it would feel pretty stale. This could surely help adding diversity.
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The JNAAM project has been completed; it was not canceled, so it will not be restarted. This budget is allocated for the development of Japan’s next-generation medium-range air-to-air missile and is not part of a joint development project. The seeker of the AAM-4B, which was successfully miniaturized during the JNAAM project, will be utilized. 次期中距離空対空誘導弾
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