Following the Roadmap: Voting to Test our Proposed APHE Shell Changes

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546

After the changes it is no longer a one shot for a T-34-85 as long as the Porsche player has any brain.

Gunner, driver and ammo (if you don’t take a full stock like a moron) are all on 1 side of the tank, so after the changes you will be able to safely expose 1 side of your tank to take the shot without damage to any critical crewmembers or modules.

After the changes spalling to the side will be massively decreased, so the spall shouldn’t reach anything besides loader and machine gunner, or maybe engine with the new “head stays on trajectory” thingy

Also APHE is not a 1 click to win round, it is 1 good click to win, considering 1 click is also all it takes for your enemy to win. Which is fair

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547

And forgot to mention, cupola shots are basically never one shots, unless you shoot a 200g+ tnt filler round (it causes internal overpressure, which will not be affected by the change, so it will still one shot) or your tank has only 1 crewmember in the hull, which as far as i know is the case only for the IS series.

All other tanks prone to cupola shots never die in 1 shot unless the 200g filler criteria is met. T-34-85s, panthers, tigers, T26E5s and so on all have 2 members in the hull that most of the time survive the shot.

Side shots on the other hand should always be 1 shot kills, no questions asked

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548

After the changes it will have higher post pen damage enough to detonate ammo, AND with the spread how it currently looks to be in the models we have been shown there is a high chance that the gunner and or commander could also be taken out with those shots…

Still with APHE and not APHEBC

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The only way after the changes that it will not be a one click is if the tank is hulled down. Which you then shoot barrel, get someone to flank, walk away and/or try to flank

Sure cupola shots are not always one shots… But you can shoot it twice and the tank will be dead so it doesn’t even matter. Want to know a sad fact?

Side shots I kind of agree with. But not when you scratch a tanks drive shaft with a shell and everyone inside dies with one shot.

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Also another note. Should a 1.0 APHE at 500m be able to kill a 11.3 Clickbait in about 3 semi well placed shots? Because this is what you can do with the worst APHE shell in game.

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550

You will not detonate the ammo, because as i have said if you take less than a full stowage, you will only have it on 1 side of the tank.

The side you are shooting at will be empty. And considering shell spall to the side can’t kill Tiger 1’s gunner with cupola shot, it will never reach Tiger P’s gunner with a hull weakspot shot. Projectile’s head might reach the engine though.

Cupola shots are hardly ever one shots and you can’t just hit it twice one after another. You need to wait for the gunner to switch back to it’s place, which gives enemy time to retreat or a fighting chance if your reload is longer than what it takes for him to restore his gunner.

And yes, i don’t mind a 1.0 APHE killing an 11.3 tank with pure side shots. You would be able to do that with any other type of shell

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551

Great.The Soviets have been weakened. The British,the French and the Americans have not changed much.The Germans are the happiest because they have huge hulls&turrets and 200mm armor.

552

6 pounder, 17 pounder, 20 pounder, 28 pounder, 32 pounder, even on the American side T53: guess I don’t exist!

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553

That’s what I was referring to when I said that apart from adjusting the APHE, you also have to adjust the damage of the other bullets to improve them and above all correct shots without damage or with minimal damage, which although it also happens to the APHE, The other bullets suffer from it on many more occasions, and there comes a point where it is disgusting to carry tanks without APHE.

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554

Which of those guns fire APHE?

555

The question, is that real? I understand that the American ammunition was not of very good quality, so they tended to break, that’s why they had the APCBC, but the curious thing is that the APCBC had a rounded tip, while the AP had sharp tip, apart from the fact that the APCBC tended to explode prematurely.

556

Very good, watch historic videos, tanks require a few shots to total kill, nerfing the 1 kill shot is good change.

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557

This will further protect me when playing the Tiger or the IS tanks from cupola shots! Great stuff!

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558

I mean it is possible that it could but the chances of it doing so weren’t likely due to how close you have to get or how incompetent the crew of the more sophisticated vehicle needs to be.

559

Here is the thing, both solutions are wrong. None of these models transfers the inertia of the round into the explosion.

This is missing since day 1 of ground forces.

You have the time to think of the distribution of shrapnel, bit cannot make a simple addition of vectors to add the grenades inertia to the explosion/shrapnel? It’s a simple addition, what the hell is wrong with the devs?

Inertia is far more important than the shrapnel distribution. Even with the correct distribution it will be comically wrong since the shrapnel going in the oposite direction of the direction the round travelled carry faaaar to much energy, which is one of the main issue of the damage modelling in WT.

Explosions are spherical relative to their origin not the target they struck, such a simple concept why is gaijin incapable of getting it right?

It’s such a simple fix, just do it already.

7 Likes
560

And now the biggest problem, make game realistic or balanced… you can’t have both.

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561

I hope they don’t ruin it lol I mean the br-482b sees composite armor half the matches and it ain’t going through them like apfsds could, if they do nerf the post-pen damage then I wouldn’t take it out if I see 10.0, that thing won’t even detonate in most light tanks it fought uptier, it just go through them without triggering the fuze and generate assault rifle spalls and feels like you are using apds and you are killing the crews one by one.

562

The funny thing is, the current sphere explosion effect simulates the damage of explosion better than the new proposition.

It’s absolutely ridiculous that the crew members sitting 2 meters from the explosion won’t get any damage, because of artificial gaps in the damage areas:

This is even less realistic that the current sphere damage!

It’s funny how so many players can see this as “realism”, but they never take into account the inertia. According to them the shell suddenly stops after penetrating the target, then explodes, and then starts moving again (but not the fragments from the explosion).

Before the devs announced this change, I actually thought they are going to change sphere damage effect to cone damage effect, which would at least make sense. But what they proposed here doesn’t make any sense and is not realistic at all.

5 Likes
563

voted :)

564

So when can we redo the calculation formula for penetration depth, which will change the performance of some vehicles

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565

I’m split on that.

First of all, thanks Gaijin for adressing issues and trying to improve the game.

Second, I dont really trust you to do a good job with that. The APHE how it works right now is working well. So why change a running system.

Personally I have problems with your “selective” realism. We get realistic APHE but we get utterly crappy BR changes that are “unrealistic”. We have russian paper tanks, but we couldnt keep the Kingtiger 10.5? We have realistic balistic models but we fight on CQC maps where tanks rarely would have been used?

The list goes on.

Either you try to make War Thunder a realistic game or an arcade-sim but not both at the same time, because that just doesnt work.

8 Likes
566

This new mechanism very rudimentary, thoughtless and inaccurate. Too many factors are not taken into account during implementation.

Shell drop his fragment around a 360 degree sphere after the explosition, not only to some circular article with different strength… not to talk the fragments got ricochet innerside after explosion. That is the reason why old/current APHE inner damage more accurate.

What not implemented which make it accurate:
-inner explosition caused wave/pressure: which able to stun crews or wounded them

-explosion caused heat: also harmfull for crew members… heat air able melt lungs or cause crew inner fire damage and if it not kill them able to stun/knock out them OR set fire electric or non metal inner part, or crew members clothes…machine gun ammo paper charges and HE shells.

-Toxis gas from explosition like Co, Co2…etc also harmful for crew explosion is a chemical process with end product(s).

-fragments got ricochet innerside after explosion

This function also want to implement to be more accurate or not? Because with this make the new mechanism 90-100% realistic accurate…

Current images not show it… current modell implement fragment spread more accurete without some earlier mentioned details…

If it implemented need a huge rebalance vehicles BR. It have a huge effect to lot of low and mid tier tanks examples from many: basically DOOM tutel(T95),Tortoise, Tigers vs Jumbo. T-34 got buff while others nerfed like shermans and PZ4 serie. Panthers become useless, M26, Super Persing lost from his firepower, T-54 serie lost his firepower and suffer from HEAT-FS and APDS one shots. Solid AP shells still as a laser shots while APHE ammo nerfed ,caused lower damage and not able to stun or perform one shot while with solid AP can. Just think a bit throught shell exploded and the fragments only wound crew instead of kill. Added the huge opportunity to enemy to shot back, casue unfair moments.

Summarize:
For an APHE ammo it’s a nerf with less inner damage. APHE lost his ability, after the implementation but from previous updates experience i m afraid it will contain a lot of bug and cause lot of gajin moments…

We have an opportunity to select between this half realistic modification (not contain: explosive caused pressure, heat, and toxic smokes) or the current working balanced modification.

2 Likes