I didn’t realize they changed it.Apparently it is in all the Soviets.
Was a good while ago, I’ll if I can find the bug report.
Edit: found it immediately. Community Bug Reporting System
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Well, the thing is that they still have the extreme penetration modifier on inclined surfaces hehe.
Not really ,any old shot has taken me out.Having a good sniping battle with another enemy and boom ,some guy in a HE firer from the 80s turns up and makes my WW2 armour a sick joke. M51 is a fine example although fortunately with much more random ammo.
When you get to Panthers BR now APHE no longer rules .The way 6BR is now certainly influenced my desire to vote yes to changing anything else so it is very much on topic.
Also the latest map disasters also made me vote no so these issues are linked.People are just distrustful of WT devs making changes.
Soon you will pay for golden bullets like WoT
The damage of the explosive projectiles is more or less well done, since these, unlike the APHE, have very thin walls on the sides and only a little thicker in the front, so when they explode they would do more damage in a sphere, although in any case I imagine that due to the speed of the projectile the damage would be generated a little more forward. Regarding the M51, well, without changing the damage model in general we will see Swings like this, tanks with many years of difference in combat, that is what we have to endure.
Would be cool if Gaijin added the 75 mm M338 round for some US tanks with its blunt nose, as it would get the same insane slope effects.
Information on M338
Here’s the flat penetration and general characteristics.
Here’s a comparison of how it would perform in game, comparing to M61 APCBC. M338 is the red line, M61 is blue line, X axis is angle in degrees, Y axis is penetration in mm.
This round would be capable of penetrating a T-34 on the upper glacis.
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I still think that although the good penetration at 60º makes some sense, it seems strange to me that they have the same penetration at 0º as bullets with a sharp tip.
That overall just depends on the characteristics that the rounds have.
M61 has a sharp tip and a cap (sharp is being generous, but that doesn’t matter much now), while M338 has an uncapped blunt nose. With the calculator, that gives M338 a flat pen multiplier of 0.9.
However, M338 has no explosive filler, which decreases the penetration of M61. It also has much higher muzzle energy (1523 kJ vs 1291 kJ), as, despite having a lower weight, the extra velocity more than makes up.
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You are aware that like
The only difference between them and the 1.0 BR tanks like the strumpanzer and stuff is really the turret.
You are aware that the strumpanzer doesn’t spam 6BR games ruining them? I mean with only 2500 games played have you even played 6BR yet? Did play it a couple of years ago when it was the best BR ? Pre Artillery spam?
Stop it with the desperate comparisons …my dude : )
yeah no shit its at 1.0
I have…?
I am up to about 8.7, so yes, I have absolutely played around that BR. Arty vehicles dont ruin it, they are thin-skinned with a massive reload.
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And mobility, reload, modern equipement
I have rarely seen a strumpanzer at 6BR and if 6BR wasn’t so full of arty spam they wouldn’t bother me either.
My point is that APHE is a drop in the ocean these days ,who cares about it when higher
WW2 BR are full of more modern ammo and when we have used the same shell for so many years anyway.
Its something over nothing.Sitting back and letting your armour do the work is a pointless exercise anyway now.Like I said ,the chances of having those log range duels with similar tanks is a memory as the Artillery just wades in and ruins it.Might as well lose the 8MPH speed and play a fast 60s needle gun or arty piece.
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Apparently not.
Again you’re showing one instance where one overpowered gun can frontally penetrate a Panther with only a possibility of knocking it out compared to APHE which is almost a guaranteed knock out, almost every other AP focused tank will bounce clean off that UFP. If you think one high powered AP is bad because it can at time one-shot a tank then how on earth are you defending APHE which frontally one-shots tanks considerably easier with far less need for precision 90% of the time.
If the ARL hits the Panther with a bad shot to the side it’ll do nothing. If the Panther hits the ARL with a bad shot to the side it’s killing the turret crew or totally eliminating the tank defeating all physics and historical documentation regarding how APHE actually works, because APHE penetration=internal bomb.
Post war vehicles fighting WW2 vehicles are an issue, but unlike post war vehicles APHE breaks game balance right from the start.
Observe how 19g of explosive filler completely annihilates a Pz IV with a shot through the front plate.
It’s utterly absurd.
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Name some tank at this br. I know only 2 : arl44 and sherman sa50, both Can Pen front in theory.
That’s exactly how i see that you have never played arl before. If you’re afraid to not kill the whole crew, you can just kill his turret, or aim his ammo, there’s a way to use ap, and flanking is obviously not a good way to play it, a Guy already said it before but it looks like nobody cares. If not playing a shell as it should be means it’s bad, then when i shoot with aphe on the engine at the back it doesnt kill the tank, aphe is bad ?
Already showed that an ap can do one shot a heavier tank with more spaced crew. Do the exact same test with exact same tank on panther mantlet, or just using any medium/heavy, and you’ll understand why isnt ap that bad
Anything armed with a 17lber for starters…
We’re getting off topic either way, the debate isn’t over whether AP can pen the front plate of a Panther (which most can’t) it’s over how APHE is completely and utterly overpowered to comical margins and breaks game balance.
As mentioned earlier please tell me how it’s fair that APHE can kill entire crews with terrible shot placement? It isn’t historical, it isn’t balanced and if you try the “some tanks need the one hit knock out!” then why is it okay for AP tanks to need multiple shots to kill yet if APHE had more of a possibility of needing 2 hits to kill it’s blasphemy?
As already mentioned APHE rounds do not lack the penetration to kill anything at their BR’s frontally and when they penetrate they’ll still do more damage than solid shot. But that orb of death absolutely has to go before anything else as it’s something that affects the game from reserve tanks all the way up to the Cold War.
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One of the most powerful gun according the wiki…
Anyway ye let’s recenter about the subject.
Since the vote ended with no wining i guess majority of players dont think this is not fair, or at there are more importants fixes to do, and that’s personally what i think, and also what every no player that came here had writen. When. You Say it’s not balanced, i cant follow you because the br balance is made mostly according the current system, and if it’s still not over that balance, for a several years system, imagine how long it would be with new system.
That’s not true, the thing being that with a t44 you dont Pen everything front, you’ll have difficult too in jumbo (i dont mean it’s very hard, just that no, aphe dont Always pen).
Ye but you dont Always need the post pen power of a aphe, and it’s also made in wt for having n’est post pen. Let me give an example, you can one shot open tank with 150mm he, but you can also with 57mm. Even for flanking, firstly dont flank ap, and secondly you Can still shoot ammo. What is painful is small ap, coz these really does not much dmg, and i’d like it to change just a dash at least, but the thing being it’s not true for all ap, the more Big rounds being enough lot of time, i cant say i need an ap buff right now. And anyway nerfing aphe wont make ap, or any other shell, better. I dont understand ppl complaining about others shells not doing enough dmg but still shitting on no, when since it can mean that ppl would rather gaijin to work on smthg else than this APHE rework, the “smthg else” could be the other shell rework.
Also it would have been great to have pictures of test shell for bigger round, 76 to 88 for example, to see what it does on tank. I can swear you that there are ap at the lvl of the tiger that one shot it by shooter in the center, but it would be really weird if it appeared that there are aphe that couldnt with New mechanic
It doesn’t unless extremely close range.
At any range over 50 meters, a 75 mm APCBC round needs over 207 mm of penetration for a 50% chance to penetrate the Panther’s upper glacis (80 mm at 55 degrees). For a 75 mm uncapped sharp nose AP round, that goes to 176 mm, but these rounds also have increased ricochet chances.
So either you use the POT-51A and risk ricocheting even if you have enough penetration to go through (and even still, it goes below a 50% chance of penetration at roughly 150 meters), or you use the PCOT-51P round, for which you need to below 50 meters to have a reliable chance of penetrating, due to the fact you need to be close enough to use your gun depression to shoot from above (which decreases the angle of impact from the original 55 degrees).
And since the 17 pounder is just weaker than the SA50 cannon (penetration wise), it obviously fares even worse.
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That’s why the in theory, on the paper and sim shot, it does pen, but i never managed to do so ig.
I just refered to wt wiki, i never played it