why bring real life service performance into this…
Iraqi F1s downed at least 2 F-14s. Ecuadorian F1s shot down several Peruvian Su-22s. South African F1s shot down at least 2 Mig-21s, among others.
A Greek F1 reportedly downed a Turkish RF-4E.
Real Life Performance does not equate to in game performance or BR. by that logic, several soviet aircraft should be terrible, since they have many times extremely poor K/D ratios, mostly due to their use in untrained, undermaintained air forces.
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Take that up with people who made the Mig23 that is one of the cons with the Mig23 series aircraft!
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Yeah but those are all things that should be factored into the br, it’s why me thinks mog-23ml isn’t as good as most people make it out to be.
Now I still do think it should go up cause balancing, like I’ve said before, but so should f1c which was the og point of this thread.
Yeah just not how that works
Why not
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The Mig-23 cockpit does however have its own pros over the Mirage F1’s.
The radar being on the Sight HUD is more useful than you’d think. the RWR is also placed in a good spot, as limited as its use is.
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Sim is balanced (barely balanced) purely on combat capabilities at their peak. it doesn’t take into consideration ergonomics or ease of flight.
If this were the case, the swedish Tunnans would be at 5.0 due to just how AWFUL their cockpits are in terms of visibility.
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If that was true mig-23mld would not be at 11.3
Or su22 at 11.7
Or J7e for example that is criminally undertiered at 11.0
Etc
In an ASB context, the reason the Mig-23 is disliked so much is because its probably under BRed.
Its 11.3, and the only true counter for it is the British Phantoms which barely anyone play imo.
Most of what should be its equivalents, namely the other PD Phantoms are all at 12.0. This means that 11.3 and 11.7 matches can feel heavily one sided to redfor.
For me, its especially annoying that the SHar FRS1 & Hawk 200 RDA are somehow the same BR as the Mig-23s (especially the MLD) and the Tornado GR1 is somehow a higher BR
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may i ask which Su-22 is at 11.7?
The Mig-23MLD could honestly be 11.7 in sim. it has the capabilities to.
the J-7E is at 11.0 due to lacking a radar, only having access to 4 IR missiles (good ones mind you, but not IRCCM ones), and a relatively low CM count. its a plane carried by its flight performance, and it cannot, in my opinion, go any higher.
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Cockpit visibility is something that could have an impact on an aircrafts battle rating in ASB. take 2 identical aircraft and give one limited visibility and other great visibilty and its clear who would likely win in a dogfight.
But its only one of multiple factors and shouldnt override everything else
ASB does put way greater value on things like radar, RWR and ergonomics than ARB does
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For example, the P-47 with razorback cockpit is at the same BR as the bubble canopy P-47s. you can guess which one has a much better time keeping track of targets.
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You right, I was prolly confusing it for mig 27.
for both of those, they’re extremely fast base bombers/attackers that can be quite hard to catch by some aircraft. Su-22s also gets a quite good amount of R-60Ms, and the german and russian later versions get a boat ton of CMs.
Mig-27 has less bombing capability, but is also much much faster. it still has enough to take down 1 or 2 bases while being faster. in the case of the 27K it also has a pretty good guided CAS capability for taking out convoys and such.
Believing on this is like say Iranian F-14 were destroyed in the current war at an Iranian base. Such it’s not true.
You bring lies from an 80s war impossible to know the true due lack of internet at that time. No multimedia at all
Is this wikipedia?
If so, this is widely agreed on being a terrible source of information.
Nobody is actually going to look at this and take it as valid proof
Why is it so hard for you to believe that mirage F1’s were used to down F14’s, is it just salt over the mig-23s only being used as bait? The “giraffe” tactic was well documented and resulted in at least 4 hits on F14’s, with 3 probable kills (in 1988 iranians didn’t record the loss of any F14). It doesn’t even require the radar to look down to shoot, and it’s not like F14’s themselves didn’t claim some mirage F1 kills in return.
As for the performance of the F1, it’s perfectly in line with 3rd gen competitors, with some advantages and disadvantages. Using the data from wikipedia, the afterburning atar 9k-50 gives about 7200 kg of thrust, meaning that the thrust to weight ratio ranges from 0,66 with maximimum takeoff weight , to 0,97 when fully empty. Not the best, but still pretty acceptable since the drag is low enough that it can still go mach 2.2 when clean, and carry enough weight in internal fuel + drop tanks to have a pretty impressive 3300 km ferry range. (for comparison mig-23 2350 km, ja-37 2200km, F-14 3200 km).
zero points being made by you.
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