F15A in 12.7 BR

Game Discussion Realistic Battle
453

If we want to get picky about stats, from 11.7 to 12.7 there are only 4 countries that don’t have winning rates.

USA doesn’t have a single >50% win rate 11.7 to 12.7 (in fact they only have one >50% from 11.7 to 14.3), Germany has a 46% at 12.3 (a Tornado), Italy has a 47.9% at 12.7(tech tree Mig-29 or Prem Mig-29), and Israel has a 49.7% at 12.7 (Baz).

Of the countries mentioned above besides for USA, the Tornado for Germany only has 60K games played.
The Italian tech tree mig-29 has a positive K/D despite having a 48% win rate, the prem one has a .8 K/D at 47.6% and over double the amount of games played/spawns as the tech tree version.
The baz for israel sits at 727K spawns, 0.91 K/D, and is responsible for the 49.7% win rate.

If we look at Germany, USSR, and China for 11.7, 12.0, 12.3 and 12.7 aircraft we find the following:

Germany:
Mig-23MLA 11.7: 8.8 million spawns, 50.6% win rate, 1.12 K/D
Tornado IDS ASSTA1 11.7: 2.8 million spawns, 52% win rate, .34 K/D (2 million ground kills)
Tornado IDS SLE 12.3: (already mentioned)
Mig-29 12.7: 8 million spawns, 51.6 % win rate, 1.06 K/D
F/A-18C 12.7: 7.7 million spawns, 48.9% win rate, 0.8 K/D

USSR:
Mig-23ML 11.7: 67 million spawns, 50.8% win rate, .98 K/D
Mig-23MLD 11.7: 10 million spawns, 52.6% win rate, 1.3 K/D
SU-25Sm3 11.7: 2.9 million spawns, 58.3% win rate, 0.47 air K/D (nearly 5 million ground kills)
Yak-141 12.7: 3,7 million spawns, 54,1% win rate, 1.31 K/D
Mig-29 12.7: 15 million spawns, 52.4% win rate, 1.18 K/D

China (including 13.0 since only 12.3 exists):
JH-7A 12.3: 4.6 million spawns, 53.5% win rate, air 0.62 K/D (3.5 million ground kills)
JH-7A prototype 12.3: 460K spawns, 52.7% win rate, 0.69 K/D (250K ground kills)
J-8F 13.0: 4 million spawns, 52.6% win rate, 1.24 K/D
J-11 13.0: 5 million spawns, 50.8% win rate, 1.16 K/D

Now compare that to the F-15A and the other 11.7 to 12.7 USA:

The F-15A is sitting at a 46.9% (up a not even a whole 1% since the start of January) win rate and a 0.69 kills per spawn and a 0.81 kills per death.

A-10C 11.7: 2.3 mil spawns, 47.8% win rate, 0.93 K/D (8 mil ground kills)
F-111F 11.7: 4.2 mil spawns, 48.4% win rate, 0.5 K/D (4.2 mil ground kills)
F-4S Phantom II 12.0: 78 mil spawns, 45.6% win rate, 0.71 K/D
F-4J Phantom II 12.0: 15.6 mil spawns, 47.6% win rate, 0.87 K/D
F-16A 12.3: 12.7 mil spawns, 46.9% win rate, 0.79 K/D
F/A-18A 12.3: 4.3 mil spawns, 50.2% win rate, 1.18 K/D
F-20A 12.3: 11.3 mil spawns 47.2% win rate, 0.71 K/D
F-14A 12.7: 29.3 mil spawns, 51.4% win rate, 1.24 K/D
F/A-18C Early 12.7: 15.6 mil spawns, 47.3% win rate, 0.76 K/D

Of the 22 planes listed, 21 have a better win rate and 12 have a better K/D, the ones having a worse K/D either being strike aircraft or premium aircraft (other than the F-16A).

Now I’d happily list more stats if this doesn’t suffice the fact that the F-15A was struggling, and is still struggling.

2 Likes
454

Two points regarding the statistics argument:

1.- The US plays mixed battles for the most part, the drift between ±55 to 45% WR to any nation affected by mixed battles is statistically logical.

2.- Be ready to get the “but duh US player is trash” argument anyway.

455

Yeah I already know that is coming. Any time I post on here that comes at one point or another.

And if the U.S player is truly “trash” as everyone likes to argue, it shouldn’t matter that the F-15A is at 12.7 since the players are so easy to beat.

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456

Only 2, and it is worse in every single other metric apart from top speed. You also underestimate how poor the MiGs radar is, because it is very easy to notch, and very finnicky to work with if a plane isn’t going right at you. There’s also the poor 12.7 Mig-29s which are even worse, having 11.0 level IR missiles and a bad airframe.

Please explain in detail how the 12.7 Mig-29 is an equivalent aircraft to the F-15A.

Maybe IRL, but in WT not really. It’s one of the least thretening planes because all you need to do is force WVR by multipathing, and you’ve won.

Sure give it Aim-7Ps, anything to stop it from being objectively better than numerous planes at a higher BR.

Holy skill issue.

When you say things like [objectively undertiered aircraft] is struggling, you should expect responses like that.

Good players will flock to play with a new OP aircraft.

2 Likes
457

Annnnd there it is. If your argument relies on “holy skill issue”, you have no argument.

The stats speak for themselves, countless planes around it are out performing it other than premiums and strike aircraft.

458
I've played at least four MiG-29s for a good time and I don't think its radar is that complicated.

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I’d agree for the early MiG-29s to get R-73s, but if you’re saying the F-15 is so OP at 12.7, then those Fulcrums should go to 13.0 as well w/R-73s, because there’s no way a Fulcrum would send an R-73 to a tornado and still be balanced in any sense within the same argumentation framework.

Opinion, gut feeling.

I repeat, the MiG-29s radar is not necessarily a problem when its missile compensates wildly for the radar’s limitations.

That doesn’t happen at all in the F-15A. You start with a mediocre missile paired with an unreliable radar, and when fully spaded you get two more mediocre missiles fired from an still unreliable radar.

459

As a player base it was but thats due to the 13.3 Su-30s and uptiers

460

Then don’t take the radar missiles, and instead bring R-27Ts if it’s that big of an issue, or as you so generously pointed out for the F-15, maybe its just a skill issue.

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(Now THIS, this may truly be a skill issue, because as I have already pointed out, the 12.7 USSR Mig-29 has 15 million spawns, 52.4% win rate, 1.18 K/D)

461

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Issue with the MIG-29 is in almost every respect it is worse then the F-15A that is the same BR

Two R-27T don’t make it even (The R-27ER are just better anyway)

4 Likes
462

Dexter Funny GIFs | Tenor

I was just pointing out that there are options. The F-15A there are not, you either have the 7m or you don’t.

463

Also the F-15A has the lowest K/D and second lowest win rate out of all F-15s (in USA)

464

R-27Ts suck.

Not wanting a 4th gen with IRCCM missiles at 12.7 doesn’t mean I have a skill issue.

With R-73s and R-27ERs, they would absolutely be 13.0 worthy. With just R-27Rs, I think they would fit into a weird place where they are much to weak for 13.0, and maybe to good for 12.7.

465

All time statistics are pretty much useless…

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This is how are they performing recently.

3 Likes
466

Glad we can agree, not wanting a 4th gen with no IOG+DL missiles going against ARH missiles doesn’t mean I have a skill issue.

467

I love like the best plane here is second worst in performance

468

i mean it is a premium so it is to be spected.

469

Still performing better than the F-15A.

470

Can you show all the 12.7 F-15s

471

Yeah the stats when it was at 13.0…

472

Ok cool, so we can agree it was struggling at 13.0. Case closed.
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And you say that like it isn’t still struggling