I agree as far as the block 10 is concerned, the ADF however is noticeably more sluggish, like I said it consistently pulls 2G less which is a huge amount for dogfighting
You are exaggerating, it pulls about 1G less, almost 1.5G if both are very light. With weapons and whatnot its 1G or less of a difference
Even if I am exaggerating (which I don’t think I am) it shouldn’t be pulling less G at all it should pull the same or more
I don’t know about the difference the elevators make IRL, but the weight does make a difference for sure, 270kg is like having 2 sparrows extra
i can show you is more than 1G and the difference is huge. more AoA in the F-16ADF/MLU is needed, because right now you have no way to fight a mig-29 or an F-16A block 10. you will just loose consistently. is not a matter of “i need or not” is a matter of testing them in 1v1 scenario and see if the performance is correct or not; in short terms, performance of the F-16ADF and MLU is not correct at all and is luckluster compared to even F-4E and F-104 above 800kph.
It’s more like 1 sparrow (AIM-7F/M are 230kg) and the elevators are supposed to compensate for the extra weight
you have to take into account the position of the weight, and 30% of increased elevator is a huge advantage. You can even look at the diagrams yourself and note that there is no difference whatsoever…
Please, the block15 still outperforms the mig29, even the better one, 9.12. It won’t be a easy fight against a good mig29 pilot but overall a block15 will win more consistently if you keep your rate speeds right
I don’t know about that, the only info I can find in a quick search is that it helps with stability and control, which does not mean much. If you have any in-depth info about it I would like to learn
the problem is the difference it makes. you have to quantify it, 280kg in a 560kg plane is 50% (empty weight), so is a huge difference, 280kg in a 7,690 kg plane is 3.6% (so same figure for wingload) is neglegible especially since is not external weight with added drag and a with a lever arm of the weight on the wing, but rather internal and placed in a way to not interfere significantly with the flight carachteristics.
So, let me get this straight. You say that a 3.6% extra weight is negligible, but a 3-4% worse sustained turn rate is too much of a difference?
3-4% worse sustained rate? where did i say that the sustained rate is 3% worse excuse me? i literally POSTED the E-M diagrams that show there is no difference in the performance of the 2 planes. you are telling me a difference of 280kg weight and compensated by 30% more elevator surface is way greater and have huge effect on flight performance compared to a NON-compensated 225kg difference between the german mig-29 / russian mig-29? there is literally no difference in those planes when it comes to dogfight in wt. if you were to test all mig-29 and F-16 in wt you would’ve known that the difference they have is a bug and not 3-4% worse sustained rate. (pls look again at the post with the 2 diagrams showing there is none irl)
People like you, that speak without the full knowledge of the fact and still refuse to even experience themselves the problem, to have an insight of it, make me wonder why they are allowed to discuss on the matter.
Ok I just did a quick test in game
Block 10 with all modifications unlocked, 6 x AIM-9L loadout
Block 15 with all modifications unlocked, 2 x AIM-9L loadout
Each AIM-9L weighs 84.5kg so the Block 10 is carrying 338kg more in suspended armament and therefore should have a higher total weight
Climbing from runways at 5 degrees until reaching 1000kph then pressing pitch axis up for 5 seconds
Block 10 - 11G
Bock 15 - 10G
Now you can repeat this yourself and if you get different results then IDK what the deal is but the Block 10 even when heavier pulls more G than the Block 15, it really shouldn’t, and that’s 1G at 1000kph, which is outside the sweet spot, and where the bigger stabilators should be helping the most, at 800kph the Block 10 actually momentarily hits 12G while the Block 15 hits the same 10G, you can repeat for any speed you want but the Block 10 is universally going to outmaneuver the Block 15 even with the extra weight.
Brother, I am talking about the game. those diagrams don’t represent what happens in-game and you know that.
In clean config and min fuel, the sustained turn rate is about 3-4% worse. You say that’s a huge performance leap considering that the weight is around 3% more. I’d say it is expected as the FM are the same except weight
Bad f-16 player
Obvious, that’s expected because less wei
I never said it is small, I only have an issue with you saying 270-300kg is a small negligible difference and should barely have any impact, while the 3-4% worse performance is expected and makes a difference even though is a small percentage. MY WHOLE POINT was that even though is is slightly heavier, that correlates with a noticeable worse turn rate of 1 to1.5 deg/s that makes a difference in a prolonged dogfight
This is false
Yes, it’s hard to read because its false. Block15 is more than able to dogfight mig29 9.12, while the 9.13 is an even easier opponent
Except even when the Block 10 is set up with more weight than the Block 15 the Block 10 comes out ahead, you need to add about 1000kg to the Block 10 to get it to perform like a stripped down Block 15. (That’s about 4 Sparrows in case you were confused).
wanna test it? since you say false false false?
i can show you that mig-29 is superior to the F-16ADF/MLU and the A block 10 is superior to the ADF/MLU. is not a matter of “I have no problem fighting this and this” is literally stupid take people have. you have to test things in a controlled environment and different situation. from your statements is more than clear that you didn’t even test those things and you are just talking bullshit. come i will show you
Both have different critical overload values, which influences what the instructor will let you do, that’s why the block10 can pull more with the instructor if both have the same weight.
In your test, if you use 20min fuel the block15 will be 58kg lighter. I did a sustained turnrate test @650kph IAS near sea level and the block15 does 21deg/s and the block10 will do 20-20.5deg/s.
As you can see, the performance is actually worse if the block10 is heavier, but the instructor will let you pull more g’s because that’s how it is setup. It’s a bad implemented limitation, you can work around it with full controls and flap trim if you need
The block10 is a better dogfighter than the block15/20 as I already said multiple times. The mig29 9.12 approaches block15 rate speeds at a much smaller circle and does better in 1C maneuvers, but it doesn’t outrate it.
Block10 has an easy time dueling 9.12’s, if you don’t hit the f-16 in the first couple turns you are done.
Block15 not so easy but still doable.
Yes please, show me