Hm. What are you doing every match? Maybe if you tell me what you do I can help with specifics.
Although it is lacking radar missiles I wouldn’t say that that makes it completely irrelevant. Especially considering you can get downtiers to 11.3 and face Phantoms, Tornados and whatnot. Dogfighting might not be very common. But merging usually is. And (although not a one-circle dog fighter) the F-16A can pull its nose around very quickly if you aren’t going fast enough. (Of course Mirages and other Delta wings beat you to it, so you need to be careful with those).
Honestly considering it’s at a BR with like every single Premium Timmy out there it’s not that hard to 9L from above (or even from behind) people who base bomb.
Yes, you can get downtiers, but from flying it on a good friend’s account (I only got back in the game recently and have no plans to fly US planes for now hence using his account) those are very rare. I played 15 games and never got a downtier, but practically every game was an uptier and you’re constantly forced into defensive flying in such cases, which is painful.
Yes, the F16A is absolutely cracked in a dogfight and can dispatch most threats handily, but again, I feel like in ARB its energy retention and excellent speed somewhat works against it. What do I mean by this?
Well, since uptiers are so common and youre fighting radar missiles a lot, you want to be able to dump speed quickly to enter a notch, defend, spam chaff, etc, and the F16 is a brick at high speeds which makes defending at close range difficult if you’re caught by surprise. Essentially what I’m getting at is that in my (limited) experience in 12.0 and up, dumping speed quickly to defend is much more useful opposed to strong energy retention for two circle fights (and those are moot at those BR’s, if you try one you will get third partied by a nice missile).
I agree, the 9L is absolutely cracked for ambush shots, especially from above. I was surprised by how easily they went through flares, especially side aspect. One shot I remember vividly was a launch on a grippen mowing the grass made from around 6km alt, the 9L I dropped on his head tracked him for ages before smacking his tail and sending him packing back to the hangar, even though the poor guy was flaring for his life and maneouvering in a panic.So, yes, the 9L can work, but an ambush playstyle isn’t consistent nor is it rewarding and your team will often disintegrate before you can mount an attack plan.
Anway, I’ve laid out my case on why I believe this jet is irrelevant, you can do very well in it, but that’s entirely dependent on a matchmaker filled with meta jets that do your job better. Basically this whole discussion all comes down to what we’re looking for. Personally I’m very busy these days without much free time to play, so I’m not keen on flying a jet that requires significant efforts to fly, I’d rather use something meta and have fun. But there are “un-meta” jets that work extremely well, for example the A4H in the pissrael TT is an absolute weapon in the right hands and I had several 6k-7k games in it, the F3h2 was also a nice surprise and is a very strong late game jet for cleaning up, even in an uptier.
…this turned into a whole essay, apologies for anyone who suffered through my yapping.
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I either try to stay with the team, but even though I have all the performance upgrades I can’t keep up. Or I side climb to the left to about below contrail altitude, so about 18500 ft. And most of the time I finish with 0 score. If I don’t I eat a PL-12 from a J-8E , I start to dogfight a Mirage F1C and after he flares all my AIM9Ls and I try the gun, he outturns my gunsight… That’s most outcomes I get these days…
Never use that thing, it’s only good for AI planes crawling around.
Thats fine, what I recommend is trying to zoom climb as soon as you spawn and hanging back in center and fly defensive to make your radar return as annoying to lock as possible, good or observant players won’t fire at someone with a weak speed gate (how fast you’re moving relative to them, the higher the gate the better chances their missile tracks and connects). You want to be a support player, at altitude, looking down on the battle and picking opportunities and then quickly going back up.
Obviously this is easier said than done and it’s also a very stale gameplay loop with poor outcomes in most cases, afaik the belgian MLU with aim9m’s (so basically you but more advanced) also suffers the same problem at 13.0 even though the aim9m’s are absolutely insane.
I’ve noticed, that the radar gunsight is trash… Works ok in headons, but that’s about it.
Even in headons it’s sketchy and imo distracts you too much, besides the vulcan is already the best gun in the whole game, you just need to point, click and quickly roll out and in most cases you’ll get a kill or at the very least a fat crit. But in all honesty I would avoid headons no matter the plane you fly, it’s a gamble and it rarely pays off.
I agree. Downtiers are not common. Especially now with the Blk 15’s and all sitting at 13.3.
Right now the matchmaker puts it in matches in which you do need to work overtime not die, let alone do well. But it performs very well on good hands.
True. Bleeding speed to enter a notch is useful. That’s why I usually drop to multipath after I’m done with any work I did from above. Also, 2 seconds of 0% throttle and airbrake can easily bring you to notching speeds if the situation calls for it. So it’s just a habit of doing that.
But yes. I agree with you. Although this thing gets praised like it’s some god, it is depended on the matchmaker and the user flying it. Which like I mentioned requires more effort to fly. Even I don’t play it all too much even if it sits at 12.3 purely because of the uptiers and the ridiculous amount of FOX-3’s that fly around, and the lack of any radar guided missiles makes it all that much worse.
Don’t trust the gunsight all that much. It can help. You should mostly aim to learn how much you need to lead with the gunsight on rather than aim entirely with it.
When you get to the center of the map during side climbing start flying towards the center. Do not drop altitude unless you are being radar locked (and/or fired upon). In most cases people don’t look up. So staying longer at high altitude makes you stay hidden better. Now in uptiers with all the FOX-3’s in the world then yeah. Drop down.
Now… Mirages flaring your 9L. First of all, if they know you’re there then no point to fire. They will flare it. Second, do not launch missiles at the adversary you’re dogfighting. It’s a waste of a missile. (Exception to this can sometimes be something like a Phantom which is a flying sun).
With Mirages if you miss the first shot then you need to basically do wonders to win the dogfight. Their one-circle flight performance and Magic 2’s are dangerous…
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This is a recurring problem I’ve noticed with the community that formed around this game, vehicles that were once broken get called OP and clueless dolts integrate that thought and never reassess them when the meta changes. The F16A was definitely a menace when it came out, but the meta changed, kit matters more over flight performance now , but if you point this out its a cascade of “skill issue omegalul”, or the dreadful “well I do well in it so that means it’s actually good!”. The latter can be applied to planes like the Ta154 or the Sakeen, absolutely dreadful planes that get carried by bad players going for headons and getting shredded, but one good player and its joever.
I managed to get 45 kills for 6-7 deaths and an 80%wr in those 15 games, although I won’t lie, my teams were also very good which helped tremendously. I also didn’t get a single kill 5 games in a row because I got focused and had to act as bait for teammates (good teammates in jet tiers? impossible i know :P) Overall I’m pretty satisfied with my performance in it but I doubt the average player will have the same success since it requires a very thoughtful playstyle and most casuals don’t care enough to play that way haha
I could use my results to call the OP bad and mock him but even though I did well I can still use my brain, look at the jet and its place in the game and come to the same conclusion as you, that’s it mid as hell and that poor OP should fly something fun instead of torturing themselves :C
True. Teams leave to be desired in this game in general… Flying for 3 minutes, check the leaderboard and it’s 2 teammates, me and like 10 enemy planes. (I’ve had countless 1v4 matches, if not worse)
When it got moved to 12.3 it was actually pretty OP just because of the 11.3 downtier. Which. I guess is valid. But now the matchmaker just kinda… Doesn’t like putting this thing in downtiers.
It uh… It does indeed require a specific playstyle which to be honest is not an easy one to get used to or even master…
I learned that playstyle from the master himself Bad Karma, that guy is a wizard honestly, his premium netz video is a shining example of ambush tactics.
hah, that was me in my ayit yesterday, endless 1v6’s in uptiers, not much you can do in those situations but fuck it we ball and I will never back down from a fight.
Aim-9Ms are only minor upgrade over the 9Ls.
Is this sarcasm?
Literally the only difference is that the seeker shuts off if it sees flares. Honestly, calling it an IRCCM missile is like calling the L3/33 CC a light tank. It technically is one, but calling it that massively overstates its capabilities.
The 9M does way better at Side and Top-Down shots. From behind it’s easier to flare than Bandwidth IRCCM.
You just need practice, get used to the plane and its mechanics, study the radar and the missiles, skill takes a while to develope
Going from a missile that is easily 1 flared from any aspect to one that is able to ignore those random flare pops at any range and have a good flare resistance in side aspect is a big deal.