F-104 is definitely the worst japanese jet plane (ki-200 doesn’t count beacause it is a rocket). It sits at 10.3. It has no flares and it is a starfighter which means that it’s only good trait is it’s speed.
Sadly at the battle rating of 10.3 it isn’t much faster than J-7, MiG-21 and the Viggen and the only thing it can practically do if one of these get on it’s tail is to fly straight while flying away at a rate of 0.1km per 5 seconds and hope they will lose interest before you fly out of the map borders. That is, however, the most optimistic situation. F-104J routinely meets these aircraft at the start of the battle when it performs it’s only tactic of climbing to stratosphere. There it can do absolutely nothing against the R-60 and PL-5c (or whatever missile the J-7 has), it cannot flare it it cannot turn away and it cannot even prevent from meeting these because by the time they show up on your screen it’s already too late.
So that leaves the F-104J with only good thing being it’s missiles, the AIM-9p. Sure, they can hit pretty reliably, however they are not flare resistant (even mig-21 has flares at this br) and they are rear-aspect so you still need to get behind the enemy without them noticing with a plane that cannot turn so if they just so happen to notice you, they can just turn away so you cannot aim at them. I am not even going to be talking about the fact that you have to grind your soul to get them (it starts with the attrocious AIM-9B - I know a lot of planes start with those at this br but they can get gun kills because they can turn) which just makes it so nobody actually plays it.
If it dropped in br to lets say 9.7, where I think it belongs, I don’t think it would be too overpowered because it would still remain a flying pencil which cannot change directions without loosing all it’s speed and AIM-9P still need to be fired behind the enemy and they are still outmaneuvered pretty easily (not to mention at 9.7 there are planes with flares already). I mean Gaijin could put A-10 (which can actually turn and kill planes) with the best AIM-9 at 10.7 so I don’t see a problem here. Morover the T-2 which has the same missiles is at 9.7 and it does just fine, it’s not terrible and it is not overpowered. What do you all think?
It cannot go that low. The F-104As should be 9.7, the F-104Js have advtanges over them and so must the higher. 10.0 maybe, but 10.3 is not unreasonable either given the transition to subsonic to supersonic is still ongoing.
But ultimately what is needed is a decompress of BR7-10. That is the best that can be hoped for it
F-104A is 9.3 so it would be higher. The T-2 I mentioned is more capable in all aspects it only has less missiles. But I don’t really care what br it goes to. It just needs to be remarkably faster than anything else than other F-104 because elseway it completely loses it’s point. I agree decompression is really needed.
And I would argue the supersonics at 9.3-9.7 are all under BRed and in fact need to be at least 0.3 higher than they are currently with few if any exceptions.
All F-104s except the A and C are overtiered and/or depressing to play.
Agreed. The 104As suffer really badly from this because they have almost no advantages in uptiers, and they have the worst jet airframe in the entire game. There are zero redeeming qualities about the F-104 airframe, mostly because their speed advantage disappears around 10.0/10.3.
Can’t go anywhere lower than 10.0 sadly.
If a high power missile slinger is about to smite you, you can turn off your engine using “I”, and turn it back on later.
“Correctly” according to Gaijin, yes. But you have to understand that a plane which has no flares and cannot turn can face sparrows and all aspects without any means to doge it. If you turn off your engine you just become an easy target since you cannot maneuver. Plus it cannot effectively outrun MiG-21 and Phantoms.
Turning off an engine in a starfighter just makes it easy target for guns. Sure it can sometimes delay your death but it is just a matter of luck just like firing a missile against AIM-9L, sometimes it distracts it and sometimes it doesn’t.
Heh ohh man be lucky it’s 10.3 (RB wise), as basically the same aircraft (meh the J is just a G but for japan) the RoC G model is 10.7 with only four of the same AAM’s, sure it has some ground ordnances but who’d be using those when the 11.0+ stuff will beat them to bases or AI.
Similarish the Italian one is 10.7 sure it has CM but only two of the same AAM’s, what are two AIM-9J/P’s to 10.7+ AAM’s.
I’m surprised that the F-104J went to 10.3 just after it received the extra pair of missiles but I was insanely confused that the RoC F-104G didn’t follow suit nor the Italian F-104G, an yet here’s a post asking for the J model to be lowered further hah hah.
I haven’t flown the F-104J (and I absolutely do not intend to) but I have previously flown the F-1 (which is in the same Japanese TT).
I’ll put it this way: if your plane doesn’t currently have CMs at BR 9.7+, then the plane is on the borderline between absolute garbage, which should be avoided for the sake of mental health, and absolutely OP vehicle that should be either nerfed or removed.
Having flown on the F-1, I realized that your main advantage is weapons (4x AIM-9P on 9.0 make planes go boom). But once you get to BR 10.3 +, you become a kind of “flying kill”: against all-aspect missiles (R-60M and AIM-9L) you have no chance, except when you carry unguided missiles (additional weight + limitation of their launch at Mach 1.0) and those rockets are launched into the front hemisphere (if from the rear, then the chance of avoiding them with rockets is very low). I am not even talking about the MiG-21s and their late modifications (MiG-21 SPS-K, MiG-21bis) as well as their analogues (J-7D), which are faster, more maneuverable (due to speed), more survivable (all of them have CMs) and in terms of armament, they are bypassed in most (if not all) parameters. And taking into account the state of ARB after, and especially during, big discounts on premium vehicles, then on an aircraft without CMs at 9.7-10.7 you can consistently encounter the aforementioned opponents (at 11.7 there are also MiG-27ML/D, against which you have zero chances thanks to SARH missiles and their radars).
I repeat: I have not flown the F-104J, and especially the Chinese and Italian Starfighters, because I can well imagine what a horror it is in today’s state of BRs. The only real sollution: the previously mentioned decompression of the BRs in the 9.0-10.7 section because the transition from subsonic aviation without CMs and very situational air-to-air missiles to supersonic aviation with CM and all-aspect missiles is probably the worst in the game (although the transition between early jets is also poorly balanced but that’s not the case here).