With the Typhoon’s MAWS giving you absolute precision, its hard to not be in the right notch, with the missile at 90-91°
Ive had some go with that few, and Ive had others needing 40-50 before the missile decided to swap. Its probably partially server related. But definetly only a BOL issue in my experience
Laddering like that is actually in-accurate, I think gunjob said he had primary sources for it being false for IR Missiles vs flares, I assume its the same for fox-3s vs chaff too.
But it shouldnt be an issue for chaff, at all, because of the angle. Laddering is mostly an issue in more rear-aspect conditions.
Well, the Harriers heat sig should have no impact at all on chaff, but their sub-sonic natures means they are far less likely to be able to kinematically bleed a missile, so they are almsot entirely reliant on getting into a notch to defend.
But yes exactly, so lets not nerf them more than is necessary, just because other aircraft are “okay”. The entire original nerf was only because the Gripen was doing too well. and literally nothing else, the better solution would have been to remove some or all BOL from the Gripens temporarily instead of just nerfing it through the floor.
The original bug report for it is full of total nonsense, should have been rejected, not accepted and then actioned
People have failed to notch in the M2k despite that plane having MAWs and 112 regular chaff at 12.3. MAWs isn’t any more accurate than regular RWR in terms of notching, tbh. Unless you’re the J-11A whose rwr is sectored or you need to dodge IRs.
Guess we’ll relegate this point to opinion (agree to disagree type thing)
Overchaff leads to laddering/breadcrumbing regardless of angle, at least that’s how it is coded in game.
It is in my opinion, because the interface is clearer than the RWR, especially with the scaling, let alone with mutliple on-going RWR contacts on top of that, which you get in an actual match and not a custom battle that Migoon keeps showing
Remember Typhoon is PD MAWS not UV MAWS, so it gives both the range and precise direction of the missile. Should show the elevation too, but the interface doesnt do that yet either
But im not sure how that works in side aspect. Because there is nothing to ladder. What is far more likely is the missile re-enabling DL and getting updates like that. And the moment I cease getting RWR/MAWS warnings, I stop dropping chaff, which should then prevent laddering even if that was the case.
For me, a digital RWR displays the missile at pretty much the same angle as MAWs, so with sufficient proficiency MAWs make no difference when it comes to notching ARHs.
The missile’s angle gate will force it to reject the old chaff and pick up the new chaff. When you over spam, the missile keeps climbing to your new chaff until it proxies behind you.
When you stop getting warnings, the missile have already overshot you, making laddering/breadcrumbing impossible.
As I said. If the MAWS warning being placed at 90-91/92° isnt a notch. Then im really not sure what im doing wrong then. I even angle my wing to be level with the missile if I know where it is, so I have the smallest RCS signature. Was recommended that when I asked for advice in regard to notching missiles coming from below.
I shall start saving some clips of missiles that should have been notched imo, but still hit me. But not going to be for a few days at least.
Still want to see BOL modeled properly soon though, especially if we see IIR missiles added to aircraft. BOL Flares were specifically designed to defeat them (yes, I know, we are probably not going to get actual IIR, but the current BOL performance isnt good enough)
The typhoon MAWS tells you exacly when the missile starts tracking your chaff and not the plane, even if the missile could still hit you if it relocked the plane
I did mention RWR warnings as well. A cessation of both warnings mean that the missile has been defeated thoroughly, and it won’t be relocking (unless occasional GPS missile black magic)
If the MAWS stops giving wanrings, its defeated 100% of the time imo.
RWR… you can still get side-lobe warnings, and I think i recall someone telling me about a bug or something with it. I once had an RWR warning from a missile I defaeted follow me back to the AF, around 40km away from where i defeated it and good, 3-4 minutes later.
I cant recall what the bug was now, but RWRs need an overhaul is the simplest answer
What if I told you that there is currently (since years and years to come) “not a bug” which causes airframes and missile bodies to be transparent to radar backlobes which in turn causes your RWR to display threats flying away from you in a ±5° cone? So a missile missing you by a close margin is displayed on the RWR coming from the opposite direction, which can be really confusing at times, or missiles that are fired in the opposite direction at a friendly and are no threat to you.
Launched IOG missiles can sometimes retrack you despite being out of energy. This is most common with C-5s and Phoenixes launched during the opening BVR (responsible for 90% of that RWR warning from your rear out of nowhere)
Oh yeah, this is common (and happened frequently) enough that I lowk thought it’s just a feature by now. Go behind any hard locking plane and your RWR starts yapping
IMO, BOL flares may or may not be un-nerfed next update if IIR missiles come.
My reasoning is the following : we (at least I) are fully expecting IIR missiles to come next patch. I believe that spectral flares should (and will) be added along side it. That would make BOL being un-nerfed more probable.
The BOL nerf was initially done because the Gripen was near unkillable compared to any other aircrafts due to the shear amount of CM it gave it. Now that devs might add spectral flares, it would even out the playing field quite significantly to let the devs fix BOL to a degree they should perform at
It is what it is, sadly. But hopefully it will get better soon (at least for IR BOL)
Not going to defend the Chaff ones, but in recent days the only one I’ve seen really complain about those is you, so it does still make me doubtful that 2 BOL chaff aren’t as good if not better than a standard chaff (I’m also quite out of the loop as every 14.0+ plane I’ve ever used get large caliber chaff, so I am not the one to ask for difference between different caliber chaffs)
Everyone arguing against it seems to argue against any changes for the Typhoon. So it’s hard to tell whether they actually disagree with the state of BOL or just don’t want to see the Typhoon get bug fixes.
Migon is also vehemently against the Typhoon getting ANY improvements to it’s A2G loadout as well, even SAL Brimstone 2s