I suspect the high alt dry thrust is too low by quite a notable amount currently.
But not spaded it yet, so wont comment until I have
dust in the wind i guess
Generally, that is sufficient.
The problem is that there are conflicting data even from the primary sources available. When it is marketing something for export and not all of the variables are available it isn’t wise to hold it as an absolute truth.
They are questioning the “primary sources” (marketing material by the company, not necessary “primary source”), because other reputable sources indicate the claims may not necessarily be true, or are but only under *reasons. *specific circumstances that aren’t realistic
Well, that isn’t the idea. The reasoning is that there is conflicting information and the reputable data suggests the marketing is stretched to make the vehicle look better and cannot be taken as a fact without more context.
Right, but what are the conditions that allow it to supercruise at 1.5 mach? Collect whatever data you can on fuel load, altitude, payload, and then come back to share the source. If you have sufficient information for comparison to the games model it can be looked at. Right now they just require more context and sources. The dev also came to the forum to directly apologize to the players for the harsh words and explained his thinking.
That is very likely, but we need more sources to prove it at the moment. I’ve been digging for information and making comparisons to the in-game model. So far it matches most of the expected thrust in afterburner from 0 to 0.75 mach at least. Acceleration seems accurate to supersonic in ~30s.
It’s not the FM or the game engine, it just lacks dry thrust at high altitude. The thrust curve in dry settings needs re-worked. Afterburner thrust is roughly accurate, perhaps they will slightly adjust the drag coefficients as well. It’s almost correct.
Every time they made a product, and yes I understood the sarcasm.
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Why?
A country looks at the marketing material, tries it out and finds that that information was a lie, it will just hurt sales not help it
They might not beleive its possible with full combat load, but the fact they dont beleive its possible in any config is just insane.
Again, what motive would there be for that. The moment a country tested it and found that Eurofighter was just lying, it would destroy the companies reputation. Something like that wouldnt stay secret for long.
I tested on the dev server with min fuel and no AAMs and barely reached Mach 1.3. If sources state Mach 1.5 then it should be able to do 1.5, especially under those extremely limited loadout weights.
Will try again when spaded on live
It is quite common, Lockheed & Eurofighter GMBH have both been caught doing this in the past. It is one of the reasons Austria has ongoing investigations into corruption regarding the purchase of their Typhoon’s iirc.
They did not say this specifically, that is something you are assuming. Perhaps another report is in order as it is quite clear they should be able to hit that datapoint of 1.5 mach with some ordnance.
Lockheed has been known for this since the F-104 issues and the government still went with the F-22 over the YF-23, likewise, people continue to buy the F-16.
I will be spaded shortly and can test.
In the absence of Primary sources (such as a declassfied flight manual) then these other sources must be used. Disregarding most of them due to unsubstantiated conjecture just screws modern vehicles like the Typhoon even further. We are already likely going to be massively nerfed between game limiations and lack of data. Disregarding what data we do have is just going to make it even worse.
No wonder people leak so much classified data on the forums, when the other sources arent accepted.
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why does the euro fighter have 64 cm? I thought it only could carry 32 flares in the 55mm spaces.
If the flight manual becomes public you better hide it from Gaijin then, I’ve seen what is inside and you won’t like it.
No one has ever leaked anything to my knowledge. Everything so far found on the public forum was something you could download from a public website it just wasn’t usable for legal reasons.
2x CM per space? idk.
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War Thunder has a very very long history when it comes to classifeid leaks
Regardless, this Canadian report suggests the Eurofighter can supercruise up to 1.5 mach but can only do 1.21 mach with full missile load. This is contradicted by many better sources saying it can supercruise up to 1.5 mach with full missile load but I wonder if they are mistaken.
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I will not satiate your strange poorly evidenced ramblings about the typhoons, you simply haven’t proved you are credible enough to bother acknowledging
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I could accept them not beleiving the conditions stated (i.e full combat load), but like I said, with min fuel and no AAMs at all, I dont beleive its possible in game currently (at least it wasnt on the dev server)
So at a bare minimum, that needs to be fixed.
It would be really helpful to be able to supercruise at high speeds when AAMs have been expended and you are running low on fuel and why I think its important to have this capability modeled, even if it was only in a far lighter load than stated in sources
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iirc It can supercruise at Mach 1.21 with missiles and external fuel tanks irl.
Correction; 6 missile, atleast 1 fuel tank, and an extra ton of flight test equipment and 700kg fornbeing the 2 seater variant.
M1.5 with full missiles and no fuel tanks should be well within its capabilities.
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I agree, but the complaints aren’t really aiding us in fixing the problem. Instead it just leaves a bad taste in the staffs’ mouths when dealing with the subject and that is doing the opposite in trying to amend the situation.
At 35,000 feet (~10,600m), I used burner to get to 1.5 mach and then cut the burner. Speed is dropping on min fuel to lower than 1.5 mach.
At 9km alt it does the same, drops below 1.5 mach.
I would not say “well within”, seeing as this appears to be the absolute maximum speed it can go. The engines would be at their absolute limit and I do not know how long they can handle the maximum temperature or if it can handle those temps indefinitely. I know there are options to increase maximum turbine inlet temp for enhanced thrust for short durations. Regardless, the exhaust velocity would be ~1.5 mach and the aircraft would be reaching the maximum speed permissible under such conditions - it will not get there quickly like the F-22.
That simply isn’t their call to make, if they are choosing to market wt as a ‘historically accurate’ military simulator then they, as a bare minimum, have to listen to feedback which comes with sources, now they have established the forums and bug reporting sites to channel this feedback, and if they choose to deny reports based off of a ‘sour taste’ then they should stop labelling WT as accurate at all
That’s untrue, also not sure it’s been marketed as a “military simulator”, but rather an “arcade sim”.
Well, the Eurofighter looks accurate and meets basic data so therefore it is “mostly accurate”. Still, there are decisions made for “balance” and those go back to the start of War Thunder.
Limiting loadouts or things like reload rate in tanks, sure. Everything else should be sorted via BR.
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@Gunjob In regard to the Eurofighter’s supercruise capability, do you want us to ping you with additional sources or information to amend Flame’s report (re-open it?) or should we submit a new report?
Some websites like this for museums indicate that they think the Eurofighter should only be able to supercruise up to mach 1.5 while unloaded
https://www.f-104.de/en-us/exhibits
I am reading in several places but cannot find the original source, but it is claimed the Singapore Eurofighters demonstrated ‘supercruise’ at mach 1.21 with air to air loadout in hot weather. It is possible that 1.5 mach is only achievable clean and in cold weather.
An example that is often touted is the English Electric Lightning which can only go up to 1.3 mach supercruise in arctic conditions if I recall correctly.
Additionally, I am reading that the reason the F-22 wants to sit at 1.5 mach for supercruise is because that is where the transonic drag is gone. As soon as they enter a speed range where the transonic wave drag is not as bad it will unload the engine and cruise at those speeds, thus improving fuel consumption and efficiency. For the Concorde this was closer to 1.7 mach. For the Eurofighter it may be lower as it is optimized for better wave drag performance than either of the other two.