That part is nonsense, another example of cherry-picking numbers to suit narratives. Rafale M confirmed already to be Mach 1.8 according to both the French and Indians.
Spoiler
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Sure…there was no F3 in 2006, when it was 10.196 kg, though.
In 2017, the RafaleM beefed up to 10.5t (by Dassault) and C/B went to ~10t (page 41).
So you’re deciding to stick with the generic 10t value and didn’t bother reading this?
Rafale C F3R has incorrect weight // Gaijin.net // Issues
It’s not generic. Dassault differentiates between C, B and M.
I can’t really be bothered with your understanding of things.
Just because the plane had a central tank, doesn’t mean the internal tanks were full.
Look, you don’t understand what you’re talking about, so let’s just stick to official figures. Ok?
The much more pressing issue is Rafale’s weight increase from F1 to F3R and onward.
From what it looks like, we’re talking about 300kg increase, so the RafaleC F3R with all the bells and whistles, like in game, easily sits at 9.8t empty.
So you really didn’t read it.
The irony of this statement, but no worries.
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Don’t really care what you type.
Where’s the report?
So, the guy took off in RafaleB at 15900kg with 5000kg of fuel.
Does that make RafaleB ~10.5t and thus RafaleC ~10.3t empty?
Right the air show card… lets get things straight and clear here.
I’m going to use this citation from the card as an example;
This is almost word for word ripped from the 2010 (Full year before the airshow (actually older keep reading to the end its from 2008) from this wiki entry;
which in turn is citing this fan site;
https://web.archive.org/web/20080226164155/https://fas.org/man/dod-101/sys/ac/row/rafale.htm
The air show card does not contain data from Dassault and is generic data from various online platforms.
Infact for completion the line
The Rafale features a delta wing combined with an active forward canard to maximize maneuverability (withstanding +9G or -3G) while maintaining stability in flight; the forward canard also reduces landing speed to 115 knots. The aircraft can operate from 400 meter runways.[5]
comes from as far back as August 2008 on wiki
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As an extra note, it’s very common for placards and airshow cards like this to use information from Wikipedia and other third party sites instead of the manufacturer. Airshow hosts usually do not have access to such information and are tasked with finding presentable information themselves.
For example, this Pakistani J-10CE placard takes all of its information from the J-10C Wikipedia article, including outdated information (like empty-weight) that has been removed from the Wikipedia article since for being misinformation.
Placards from defence expos are a lot more useful and accurate, as those are made by the manufacturer themselves to advertise their own product, rather than by airshow hosts.
Another example I can think of is MiG 1.44 specifications displayed during MAKS 2015; they not only got the physical dimensions of the plane wrong but claimed it could go 3,180 km/h (lol)
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So, here’s the source…
1.6.5. Masse et centrage
La masse des avions au décollage est de 14 490 kg pour le leader et 14 587 kg pour l’équipier. Le centrage est
dans les normes pour les deux avions.
1.6.6. Carburant
− Type de carburant utilisé : F-34
− Quantité de carburant au décollage :
• Avion leader : 4 760 kg.
• Avion équipier : 4 670 kg.
Ce carburant est contenu dans les réservoirs internes des avions. Les bidons ventraux sont vides pour la
présentation.
− Quantité de carburant au moment de l’évènement :
• Avion leader : 2 900 kg.
• Avion équipier : 2 968 kg.
What we see here is the leader having 100kg more fuel, but is, somehow, 100kg lighter on takeoff than the wingman! Interesting…care to explain how that happened?
…or is it possibly, a typo, that you used to make a false report on Rafale’s weight?
Also, while on topic, care to explain how does the Rafale, in game, have 9300kg empty (“EmptyMass”: 9300.0,), which is 181kg lighter than what you “calculated” from the aforementioned report?
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His justification at the time was that one pilot was simply bigger than the other and that both planes didn’t have the same amount of unusable fuel.
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Bingo! Fuel!
I made the French reporters aware of it far before Gunjob was aware of it. And even explicitly pointed out that the pilot sets it to 800 to clear the warning. They tried to obfuscate that fact on the forums. I can send screenshots if you would like to see.
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Well, that simply isn’t possible as MB16F has a range of 63-106 kg, so the weight difference should be larger than what the ejection seat is cleared for. I mean, if the difference was as large, one of the pilots wouldn’t be allowed into the cockpit.
Absolutely, I think the fact that they were made aware but decided not to update the report in good faith is willful ignorance and reporting in bad faith with a personal agenda to buff a specific vehicle.
I am aware.
In the initial bug report I pointed out that one pilot would have to be the size of Arianna Grande and the other would have to be Ed Hardy after eating Arianna Grande to get the weight difference he claimed.
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Also, the wingman had 68kg more fuel than the leader at the moment of the accident, while initially had 90kg fuel less, than the leader. Admittedly, I didn’t see the flight, but it’s usually the wingman who gets loaded with more fuel and spends more fuel, as he’s the one who needs to catch up with the leader. Not the other way around.
I think you are overthinking this.
It’s simply a matter of convenience of finding the best possible data points that will make the Rafale better in the game.
It doesn’t even really matter where they originate from because we can just say that a secondary source is a primary source, DM a tech mod who is friendly to us, and then the report will be forwarded as soon as it’s submitted.
That’s basically the first of what was happening with the Rafale. For instance the turn rate report where they used HUD footage was completely out of character for Gaijin and a thing they definitely said they would not use as a source in the past. However that bug report was paired with some Austrian brochure that claimed it could do 23 degrees per second on at sea level…so it got passed. The brochure wasn’t even from anyone remotely involved in Rafale either.
It would be good to nerf the Rafale
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That’s just the final leg. However, they spent almost 2t of fuel prior, so if the leader had an extended solo, it’s possible the fuel discrepancy was as reported. If all they did was a formation flying then, it’s almost 100% typo.
But as I said, this is just conjecture that is by no means the ground for a bug report, at least, according to standards that GJ imposes on other planes. I produced the other report that shows, by Macron’s logic, that the RafaleB is supposed to have 10.5t empty…
Also, from, at least two, operator’s sources we can see that the plane was 9.5t empty in early standards (F1/2?), but beefed up to almost 10t in the late standards like F3R that we have in game.
I mean, it’s nothing unusual. EF got 160kg between tranches 1 and 2, F15 got 300kg from A to GE, the F16 got from 7350 at B.5 to 9350kg at B.60. Everybody picks up the weight as the capabilities increase. Not sure why the Rafale would be an exception.