Inb4 gaijin adds it to Russia because they are suffering
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Anyone else noticing everything else getting air tracking except the cv90 🧐🤔
this post is good, because we can discuss further about the variants and armaments of the CV, especially the CV9050 with 50mm caliber that could have been added.
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Because there is no proof of the CV90 having video tracking (except the LVKV Tech Demonstrator, which is why the LVKV in-game gets it). What it has IRL is inertial “cruise control” for the aiming, something not yet implemented into WT.
Yes but it’s common knowledge it has air tracking, as well programmable air burst rounds so why not just add it to satisfy people then take the time to work on a poor implementation of the actual system and add it later…
It doesn’t though. Not really. It doesn’t track anything, the gunner shoots one laser to measure distance and then another to compare how much the turret has turned and how the distance has changed and then it just keeps that rate in change going continuously. So if the target turns the aim will keep going in the same direction as if nothing happened and not follow the new direction of the target.
We should hope for cv9030/40/50 mkiv eith aps or cv90120 MKIV with the amap and 12,7mm remote gun this year, but i guess these are big words
No, hope is the correct word ;)
We’ll be lucky if the next CV90 isn’t ruined by fictional armor and weight
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A proper Strf 9035 with programmable ammo, Iron fist APS and Akeron would be an awesome addition please snail
You’re asking for too much, lower it to something like the CV9025 at like 12.7 and we might be blessed with that at 12.7
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Bofors testrigg on the ikv 91 hull at 13.0, Take it or leave it
the mkiv can do that or even a 50 mm with the d series turret but gaijin doesn’t know about it so its not real
There is no evidence suggesting that a Bushmaster 3 with the 50mm barrel was actually ever fitted on a CV90 so far though
All that was ever shown was the standard 35 mm barrel with a larger muzzle brake and barrel shroud.
Which is also the one people claim uses a 50mm because they dont understand that “35/50” refers to the standard Bushmaster 3 used in all CV9035s.
E.g. BAE Systems Hägglunds CV9035 brochure (2006)
The 35/50 part solely refers to the option that the gun can technically be modified by (among other things) swapping the barrel to fire 50x330 Supershot.
But that applies to every Bushmaster 3 and not a singular service vehicle uses the 50mm barrel + 50x330 CTA ammunition - doubtful whether any prototype vehicle was ever made with it.
They even developed a new dedicated 50mm gun that is intended for the U.S. armys’ future IFV program (and doesnt fire 50x330 CTA either)
It’s going to be VERY hard to tell the difference between the two guns unless they are side by side, their dimensions are very similar. But i think it has actually been seen with the 50mm canon, if you compare the lengths of the barrels of some of the images it does look like they have shown a version with the 50 mm mounted. Look at how far the barrel goes past the front hull (exclude the muzzle break and just look at where the barrel itself ends).
Angles makes it a bit harder to see, but i hope you see what i mean.
I’m very uncertain but i also just found this where it looks like they might have the two versions next to each other (timestamped to 2:25): ( https://youtu.be/4981iDi_SWM?si=m3GTZ8gQZl0_WfXZ&t=85 )
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The last image does not show a 35mm Bushmaster 3 but a 30mm Bushmaster II MK 44, simply looking at the barrel length gives that away - the Bush 2 is ~60cm shorter than the Bush 3. (reference: Northrop grumman bushmaster 2 and bushmaster 3 brochures: MK44 / MK44S 30/40mm / Bush III 35/50mm
Also the length of the gun on the demonstrator you say could be using the 50mm is not much different than the 35mm on other CV90 MK IV’s;
CV9035NL MLU (circa 2022)
This one shows the extend of the barrel very well too and its clear to not be a 50mm.
CV9035 during BAE Systems demonstration
The slovakian ministry of defence is also pretty specific about it;
The primary issue is that, we simply do not know the full dimensions of the Bushmaster III if the 50mm barrel is equipped (No, XM913 is NOT the same as Bushmaster III 35/50!)
However, ATK themselves write that the ammunition used is supposed to be 50x330 Supershot from Rheinmetall, whom (together with Mauser) actually made a cannon and testfired the 50x330 ammunition - and we do have full dimensions of it:
The total gun and barrel length would be increased by 1.1m when using the 50mm barrel (and mind you that the 35mm was L/90, wheras the 50mm was “only” L/85)
Just the barrel length of the Rh 503 alone is over a meter higher than the entire Bushmaster 3 - and I geniuenly do not see over a meter of length difference between the MK IV with the fancy muzzle and the 9035 MLU.
And just a small display on how quickly point-of-view can screw over our perception of dimensions:
The top barrel is over a meter longer than the bottom one - now does it look like that? Not really, right?
Also during an interview from 2019, a Northrop Grumman spokesperson says the following:
“What we are showing for the first time here in public is our 50mm Bushmaster chain gun, designated by the Army XM913”
Spoiler: Timestamped video reference & XM913 test-firing footage
This gun is not advertised for being capable of firing both 35x228 and 50x228 in Northrop Grumman brochures - so it’s most certainly not that either.
As of now (especially given that neither BAE Systems, nor Northtrup Grumman themselves at any point said that this prototype featured a 50mm barrel and would fire the essentially dead 50x330 Supershot cartridge) I do not believe that this demonstrator ever featured a 50mm barrel and that it is rather just a fancy barrel shroud and muzzle-brake.
Of course, if someone is to provide more specific information rather that is not solely based on “it says 35/50 and looks big so its 50mm” then feel free to share it - maybe I’ll change my mind then but as of now, I will stay with my conclusion that its not a 50mm.
You can use this as reference ig;
It’s not mine but a great collection nevertheless.
Edit:
Okay cool, so I guess it could quite literally be anything at this point.
Edit 2:
I hate doing this but as I am going through the folders again it’s only getting more clear, so Edit 3 (will be the last one, I promise)
Look at how thin the barrel becomes towards the muzzle-brake…
And the tent in the background undeniably shows a CV9035 too…
Thanks for the very detailed reply :)
Is it not? Do you have more info showing this? I’ve been able to find very little information in general on this.
What still confuses me a bit is that there likely are two versions of the barrel marked 35/50 that are then both 35mm?
Look at the base where it’s mounted, and one is clearly longer than the other:
Spoiler
( https://youtu.be/ndZmqzT2nxs?si=lk7Z5b8zNA6AEzUi&t=26 )
( https://www.saab.com/globalassets/cision/images/20231011-en-4647184-1.jpg )
Did they use a 30mm and just paint it to say 35/50 just for the show perhaps? Or is it two different gun systems that are both 35mm? I think this is what has been confusing me a lot.
Then you have this one from just last year:
Edit:
The XM913 (50mm) is just 10cm longer than the bushmaster 35mm:
Spoiler
They both fire the **x228 ammo.
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I should probably clarify that I wrote this so people dont send a picture of XM913 to claim “oh but they used the 50mm barrel for the bushmaster mk III”
As said previously, it is most likely just a mock-up barrel shroud with a new muzzle-brake.
In one of the pictures I added, they list the Bushmaster II 30/40mm on the infocard next to it.
So to be fully honest, the used gun could quite literally be anything at this rate, but I do not think its the 50mm barrel version of the Bushmaster III, nor the XM913
They even show a similar shroud in their renders of the MK IV…
Just for a tiny looking base 35mm to stick out. I guess they just want it to look cool, Idk
(yes its supposed to be 35mm Bushmaster III, it’s a render for the czech CV90 MK IV)
Thats just the length of the cartridge though - the lengths of the full projectiles may differ.
Northrop grumman has not mentioned the possibility of using 35x228 ammunition on the XM913 though. In the interview they said they scaled up the Bush 3 to allow firing 50mm ammunition.
The Bushmaster III has always been advertised with being able to fire 50x330 Supershot from Rheinmetall with a barrel swap (and additional minor modifications - albeit more significant ones than Rh 503 e.g.), I posted the ATK brochure for the gun earlier here - which says exactly that.
50x228 - XM1202 TP-T
35x228 PMD060 and 50x330 Supershot
Most likely because these are not the same turret.
If you look closely, you can see just how much further forward the gun is placed on the second demonstrator - on the top picture below, the “thick” part of the gun-shroud barely clears the turret-face and goes in much further than on the bottom picture.
The dimensions right before the big muzzle also just dont fit the 50mm XM913…
The muzzle-programmer is a mockup, given how much it bents down, I doubt there is even a real barrel installed
actual 35mm gun with the programmer
The ammunition shown is 35x228 and 30x173 - the main giveaway is the belt-groove that is present on Rheinmetalls IFV ammunition for the 35mm Bushmaster III (and on Oerlikon Type KDA and KDE) but not on their IFV 30x173 mm ammunition.
Alternatively, the amount of fragments in the ABM shell shows it quite clearly aswell - PMD330 features 407 pre-fragments.
That aside, looking at the actual bore within the muzzle-brake doesnt really give me any confidence in it being a 50mm either;
The picture you said could show the 50mm is from Nato Days 2023 (cz)
and again, look at just how thin the barrel becomes:
And again, BAE Systems does not mention this vehicle using the 50mm specifically anywhere.
35/50 is simply part of the guns’ name ever since it was offered.
Again, if there is any proper evidence for this being a 50mm then I won’t oppose it but as of now I dont believe there is as everything that the 50mm barrel thingy seems to be based on is;
→ “it says 35/50”
→ “it looks longer than 35mm”
→ “it has a big muzzle brake”
→ “it doesnt have standard 35mm programmer”
while at the same time these things are put into question by:
→ Target array from 35mm firing tests infront of vehicle
→ Ammunition for 35x228 and 30x173 (RWM) infront of vehicle
→ mockup shroud and programmer on another demonstrator
→ 50x330 Supershot is not used by any nation nor in active development
→ none of the related OEMs ever mentioned a CV90 being fitted with a 50mm
→ muzzle-brake has a significantly smaller inner bore
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Thanks :)
Found this:
https://www.baesystems.com/en/article/bae-systems-cv90-with-new-d-series-turret-unveiled-at-dsei
But then in interviews at that exact showcase they say it’s the CVV9035NL MLU… so … urgh…
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Cv9050 when ?