Merica
I don’t understand why the 13.3 br exist. Most planes at thar br can survive 13.7. It just seems like a way for players to fox 3 farm players that dont evem know how to evade fox1 down to 12.3.
Only if the F-15A/J/Baz is able to lock any non head-on targets with its fake PD radar that behaves more like a PD HDN.
Why not, it’s an already flawed mode anyways. Furthermore, it’ll become even more unbalanceable at the higher echelons going forward.
They should’ve left the sparrow f16ADF variants alone and broufht the su27/j11 down to 13.0
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Sim isn’t that bad. It is salvagable. F15 on narrow band is actually pretty good. If you lose lock on the deck while the enemy is nothing switch to pd ram. It wi guess where the target is going. Which helps you with relocking the target. It is actually very good for a 13.0
Noone is forcing 12.7 to fight 13.3: Select days when the rotation has 12.7 as its max BR, and chose a map / bracket that suits you, and you’ll be fine.
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So some of the planes in a given br shouldn’t be used? That sounds dumb. The. Why even have that rotation?
Me when I see everybody bring Vipers or Hornets in GS server :/
Of course you can use it, but if you chose to fly a 12.7 against 13.3’s, you can’t really complain that you’re at a disadvantage.
I actually feel quite like you, and don’t like the Fox 3 gameplay at all. So I avoid flying it. Simple.
There’s enough fun to be had at 12.7
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Yes you are right. I forgot how much better the MiG-29s radar was. I think F-15A should be moved down to 12.3 BR where it’s is more competitive with planes like MiG-23 that have comparable radars.
I am in agreement. PvP creates a toxic game environment. I think we should focus on single player missions where bot kills count towards statcard numbers and rewards.
5 Likes
I know it’s clearly not good either, but Gaijin gave it missiles which mechanically compensates that weakness with IOG+DL guidance.
Can you argue like a reasonable human being and a somewhat respectable content creator, and not some whiny pilled ruskie main on the Russian forum?
Wow. Just wow, I would’ve expected this whole sardonic approach from the most cynical people in the forum, but its disappointing that it comes from you in particular, while I still have a decent opinion of your work overall.
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It has TWS which makes it much better than the F-15 which doesn’t have TWS. We should definitely ignore everything else about it though.
Why? This is the same debate that has been going on for the past year and a half at this point with the 13.0-ish bracket.
If you actually look at where experienced players have migrated for this BR and what they play the most of…it is not the MiG-29G or the regular MiG-29s. Everyone that wants to be when semi competitive at this tier is flying some kind of Western airframe; either some F-16 variant or an F/A-18 variant. Why do you think that is?
This is the practical reality of everyone in sim wanting their own little battle rating bracket where the thing that they like to fly will have to face the bare minimum opposition whatsoever and the “correct” way to play the game is just to migrate through whatever is the OP flavor of the day.
For instance…want to do well at 12.0-13.0 day? Break out that F2 Premium. 11.7-12.7 day? Eagle rahh. 12.3? Better ride around in an F-16 w/ magic 2s on it or break out the Netz.
Like the whole motivation for this post is to basically make it so every single viable 12.0-13.0 plane ends up on one side of a match. It’s in the same vein that players ask for historical matchups where in practice nobody would be willing to play the disadvantaged side.
3 Likes
You’re just upset that he disagrees
Counter point:
At prop BRs you can take a 4.0 aircraft to 5.3 or even 5.7 and have plenty of fun (Bf 109 F-4, P-51C(this one people say is under brd, but worth mentioning for the example) are ones I tried. I am not a good player - just average & play solo so this isnt even a case of some streamer sealclubbing in a squad or sth). This level of flexibility may not be fully required for jets but why be content with “you shouldnt use a vehicle in its natural uptier range if you want to have fun”?
If that would be the case, I’d be replying to the same level of exaggerations, some elementary school levels of argumentation anyway.
If anything, it just shows how a content creator who criticized a french main for behaving like a main (and lying on documents to get a plane to be better), just plays the same hypocrite card on dialectics if he deems a plane or something inaccurate or underperforms to his balance expectations.
Fox-3 power creep also affects Air RB to sadly FOX-3s dont really belong at 13.3
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Okay buddy, let me take your argument seriously for a second since we are on dialectics and I have a little bit of time.
First off I think you need to understand that this is a simulator battles thread and that this is a game mode that you do not even play to my knowledge. So I will have to make some comparisons that are relevant to your game mode.
The whole premise of this ChatGPT generated thread is that SARH planes should not face ARH planes at all and that the 12.7 F-18 is at a critical disadvantage.
First off the battle rating brackets for sim rotate so there are days where 12.7 and 13.0 are the highest end of the bracket the F-18 will compete in. There are no ARH slingers at 12.7 unless we count the F-14 Tomcat and the IRAF Tomcat; both of these which end up on the American team. Our next bracket at 13.0 does have ARH slingers in the form of planes that are basically 3rd generation airframes with ARH strapped to them; think Saab JA-37, Kfir, J8F, etc. Every other 13.0 airframe is some form of 4th generation fighter most of which have reasonably strong flight models; the most popular plane at this bracket is the F2A ADTW with an AESA Radar, IRCCM missiles, and Aim-7F. Gripen-A is also at 13.0 with it’s basically unlimited countermeasures and IRCCM missiles.
The MiG-29 is arguably the worst of anything in this BR range; this becomes abundantly clear when you realize that the majority of sim maps will be flat ones like Denmark which makes radar missiles easily vulnerable to multipath. The 2 R-27ERs on the MiG-29 are not guaranteed kills that some people like to claim they are.
It is not until you get to a 13.3BR rotation that the F-18C will see an ARH missile on an actual 4th generation airframe; and guess what…it is likely to be on it’s own side. This is also the first battle rating where the Su-27 Flanker is present and it is hard countered in most circumstances by the F-16A ADF which now has TWS radar and AMRAAM. This is also the BR where you see ARH equipped Flankers as well in the form of premiums. The J-11A is the same plane as the Su-27 except with the added benefit of MAWS and of ARH missiles; it is purely an upgrade.
The argument that preceded this one also preceded the Flanker flight model change; there were people advocating for it to move to 13.0 where it would be against opponents like F2A, Gripen, etc that all enjoy significant situational awareness and flight model advantages over it. This was opposed by the usual refrain of “R27ER OP”; never mind the fact that game mode has already experienced a meta where R27ER was the strongest radar missile in the game and when multi-pathing was even easier; and in that meta the Su-27 was irrelevant.
In fact a lot of the sim community push for 60m multipath was predicated on the experience of not being able to utilize radar missiles to keep something like a Gripen from just flying straight into you and then winning the dogfight. This is something that I did hundreds of times with the Gripen and basically any other plane when the R-27ER was the “top dog” missile. That was the actual context where 60m multipathing was advocated to counteract turbo-dogfighters w/ IRCCM missiles.
Since that argument was initially made the Su-27 received a flight model buff that puts it on-par with to slightly superior to the other 4th generation airframes. And also since then there has been a downwards BR movement of the F-15A (arguably the 3rd best 13.0 in the game) down to 12.7 BR where it enjoys basically every possible advantage afforded to it. At the same time there has also been downward movement of different F-16 variants; there are 2 different F-16A Blk 10 variants at 12.3BR and there are also IRCCM equipped F-16s at 12.7BR.
When you actually look at the game in the 12.7 + 13.0 bracket and track the number of games between Soviet / Soviet-adjacent fighters vs NATO/Nato-adjacent ones you will find that they are played around 9 times more frequently. If you play 12.7BR on the day where it is the top of the bracket you will see that teams consist of a majority of NATO planes on both sides. Why do you think this is? This is a rhetorical question; they are played because they are premiums and they are played because they are exceptionally strong at that bracket. It does not take a lot of effort to figure out how to multipath on Denmark, fly past the R27ER, and then win the dogfight against the MiG-29. This is something that would be glaringly obvious to anyone that plays the game.
7 Likes
Alright, argument conceded.
AFAIK, even in ARB, top down SARH/ARH slings usually end up in kills if the target doesn’t maneuver diagonally or basically notchs, to which the missile would just go pulse mode and be evaded anyways.
And same goes for top tier ASB given Statshark data. The single Su-30 has more games played (and a higher winrate) than the three AESAphoons and Rafales combined, proving your "no one is willling to play on the disadvantaged side", which was the most decent argument you put on the table throughout your last three messages.
Welcome to War Thunder I suppose? The game always had brackets where gens of plane matchups swayed between blu and redfor. This cheap narrative of looking for a way to gimp blufor just to satisfy the ever so suffering redfor winrates for “balance” just vanished the moment both USSR and China hit over 55% on usual basis at top tier since at least december last year.
I havent read a single redfor main concerned over the stomping winrates they have at top tier, and as usual, are claiming skill issue as the usual conceited people they just are once they get the thinnest upper hand.
Top down slings does not exist, I suppose. It was a collective hallucination in aviation concepts.
I must say, I gotta thank the slight effort on regurgitating the same old arguments on redfor suffering, now it’s obvious they must also dominate 12.7/13.0 and every single bracket, as if ground isn’t enough.
They don’t dominate ground.
