CAS problem

Game Discussion Realistic Battle
1250

Well, i dont believe in it myself, but i also didnt believed they would fuck up grb up with the CAS we have now and Attack helicopter, attacker drones or atom bombs…

No one believed in Naval aswell, or Modern MBTs…

One exception, why now is a Tank Mode more viable, the Playerbase didnt grow this year, that never happened before.
And certainly more people want a Tank Only mode then a Naval mode… so…

Only reason why they havent done it: Money. There is simply nothing special to sell here that is not sellable in Combined battles.
But at one point a the seek for a bigger playerbase, or a playerbase that dosnt grow anymore (like we have right now) will be enough that a Tank Only mode will make more money again, as it will likely increase the playerbase further or stop people from leaving so quick.

2 Likes
1251

Don’t need to lol. Meanwhile the tank only people, man you guys better start a religion and hope for it in the afterlife with how much of a pipe dream that is.

It boils down to money because SPAA’s, helicopters and to a lesser extent planes are all combined arms aspects that people can and have put time and money into. The one thing Gaijin doesn’t take lightly is messing with stuff people have put money into because let’s face it: adding a tank only gamemode is on some level taking away from what those players invested in. What if you bought a SPAA or heli or whatever thinking it’s a crucial component of GRB and now you learn you can just hop in “tanks only” and skip all that? You purchased something and the value was modified, not something to be taken lightly. That’s why Gaijin will compensate you for the meager pennies you lose when they remove a modification that probably cost sub 300 GE.
I could go on all day about the possible consequences here.

Furthermore if there is anything you couldn’t accuse Gaijin of, a lack of vision is definitely not one of them. You may think that this adherence to their vision is limiting the game but in reality this combined arms aspect is one of the things that keeps people playing. It’s the hook, it’s what captivates a gamer and keeps them engaged and playing while keeping their product unique to the player. You may not respect what interests other people but like it or not it’s there.

This is really going to explode your mind but the truth is GRB is a gamemode that can be enjoyable to all kinds of players. My experience lately grinding Italian tanks is I did not want to spawn planes but yet I had a lot of fun playing tanks and I had a lot of fun engaging with the combined arms aspect by using SPAA’s and attacking/using scout drones. You don’t have to be a CAS main, SPAA main or tank main to enjoy playing GRB, in fact it’s always better to be a ‘everything’ main in GRB.

1252

Well, from my expirience with gaijin… they dont really give a shit about what people have already invested in… they only care about what comes in the future, as old people have already spend their money and they will not get it back. How many times Prems got changed? How many times people got a compensation for it? Was it 2 or 3 times out of 500 changes? If u compare it to other games, like WoT… a single change to a Prem and u can choose to get 100% compensation for it or to keep the tank with changes.

You could do the excakt same argumen, about lower value of CAS, the other way around, by adding Helis and Strong CAS the peoples Prem Tanks got less worth back then, as CAS was now a thing.

Please let me share your “possible consequences”, cause i dont see any other, other then what i have already saied in the last post.

I dont know how long u play the game, i havent checked, but i can tell you the story of how the game was, when there was no CAS, no Helis, no Modern MBTs with Computeraided Gunsystems…

Back then, it was a Competitve Team PvP game, people tried to do their best, to have fun learning and winning and playing together. The planes where able to get 1-2 bomb drops and the guns where mostly not powerfull enought to even destroy a module on the tank. People went into a plane to revenge bomb or kill an important target, then spotted for the team and when they noticed an enemy plane they dropped their bombs and went for a dogfight, when they noticed they are not winning the ground the people left the plane instantly to respawn as a tank…

all that stuff is barely happening these days. My low and high rank Planes can shred whole teams apart if they dont counter with SPAA or their own Fighters… that was simply not possible back then.

But back then the people where happy, they didnt raged as much, they enjoyed the relativ fair game.
Now everyone is full of hate when they get killed by a Heli that pressed a button and went afk and still getting the kill without the tank being able to counter it unless they respawn in an SPAA or Plane… hows that fair or fun?

These days the game has shifted from being a Competitive PvP Teamgame to a lets chat in Voip, take our tanks, drink and drive, buy the new shiny toy to be able to even compete and have remotely fun…

The wording “low tier is funtier” dosnt come out of nowhere, theres a damn good reason for it, sadly with new mechanics, vehicle classes and so on its getting worse and worse even there. 4.7-7.3 is still kinda fine though.(but still far away from what it used to be)

I guess thats also why the playerbase didnt grew this year, for the first time ever.

So they have to do somethink, whatever that is its better be good and fun or we will eventually see even a lowering in playerbase till next year…

3 Likes
1253

Planes in ground battles is 100% the worst thing in War Thunder. Far to easy to get a plane…

Honestly cas players are the worst.

5 Likes
1254

Like with premium vehicles and changing of their characteristics and B.R.

4 Likes
1255

why would now not be an exception? are you a gaijin insider who sees into every plan and suggestion being taken into consideration inernally?
has top tier existed for 10 years in war thunder? no it hasnt, its relatively and the number of people complaining about CAS is only increasing

4 Likes
1256

Yeah but money ? What a surprise , TO will never come , that simply the way it is. Also they need to give CAS or premium CAS perform it main role. They can’t just magically separate them because “the number of people complaining about CAS is only increasing”. Sorry but it doesn’t work like that , if you actually want change
Vote with your wallet
That all im gonna say or the actual way to fix CAS is minimize the effect of CAS to a certain extend by fixing the problem that directly linked to them. That a better way cause SPAA will be able to do their job better and contribute more to the match

1257

CAS is insanely easy to get, but the one thing that CAS players will struggle with is weather conditions. If it’s clear weather, AGMs will be extremely lethal at long range, but if it’s a storm or low cloud cover, CAS aircraft normally have to get closer to use their weaponry effective. Another possible solution could be SPAAs designed for taking out munitions, like the C-RAM. CAS is both a horrible thing and a good thing, the issue is balancing it.

1258

It’s never as simple as that and while premiums may get changed I have not heard of a single one becoming unable to be played. Furthermore when you consider the amount of SPAA that a player can talisman you realize it’s more than just the vision that keeps Gaijin from ever doing a TO mode.

I’ve played since 2013, not that it matters because anyone can uncover this by viewing old gameplay videos: War Thunder’s CAS problem goes back far and it’s had periods that were even worse than this. You used to be able to delete people with HVAR’s which had the one-hit splash range of a 1000-2000lb bomb, a single P-47 could wipe multiple people easily while facing manually aimed SPAA that required good shooting ability to use. Compared that to now where a plane with guided weapons or ballistic computer could be deleted by someone pointing and clicking with a Strela-10 or any number of systems.

There is no “back then”, bullpups used to totally dominate, nords same thing, SACLOS update destroyed the physics of those SPAA missiles so badly that CAS couldn’t even be threatened without another plane or heli/IR SAM, the drone update spawned attack drones in space and against SPAA that could do nothing but get farmed, the old age of heli’s where you literally had to face them using garbage gun SPAA.

People see now as a exception, the truth is it isn’t, it’s not even close to as bad as it’s been in the past. Heli’s are up BR’d heavily now, most of them being +1BR or more from where they were, drones got nerfed heavily, SPAA’s have ammoboxes to cope with having to engage so many targets, scout drones can be shot down more easily and pad SPAA scores(dat battle activity), introduction of more powerful SAM systems(multiple nations having the Osa+Strela-10, which covers most bases), IR/TV trackers for light tanks, powerful heli AAM’s such as the TY-90, mistral and AIM-9M.

You act like this issue is just top tier, from what I see it’s something that will exist as long as planes and helis can destroy tanks. You think the amount of people against CAS is going up but it’s more like it’s staying the same no matter how much it goes up because unlike before it’s not a universal consensus, which it pretty much was at various points and the reaction from Gaijin never was to remove CAS; so what makes you think they will now lol? There is zero indication in the past or present that Gaijin see’s this as an exception, they will do what they did before and at best nerf it somewhat. Judging by the new update teaser probably more like ‘buff’/add more SPAA.

1259

its called ground battles for a reason

1 Like
1260

The thing is that all this vehicles could still be used in combined mode.

2 Likes
1261

exactly. so keep the current gamemode unchanged, and simply add a tank only gamemode.
SPAAs and aircraft are already separated, because aircraft get a dedicated gamemode, while SPAAs only get to play mixed battles. so do the same for tanks

well to any gaijin employee reading this, i assure you i would spend MUCH more money if i played tank-only instead of mixed garbage

we are talking about adding a gamemode this whole time.
adding TO does not remove the current existing gamemode, and CAS can keep playing it.

the issue is gigantic at top tier, but i didnt say CAS isnt infuriating at any BR

hating CAS is relatively universal, and definitely one of the most universal things in war thunder for what thats worth.

i never suggested to remove CAS. again, just add another gamemode for tanks only.
aircraft have a gamemode, tanks should too.
isnt this so simple? nothing is being removed, nobody is being “harmed”, why do you see this as physically impossible?

4 Likes
1262

The only thing i agree here is: That there was times that where even more stupid, that most of theses times it was 1 or 2 broken vehicles or a mechanic that was fkt up for a few weeks. Not more.
They are working on ghetting the absurdly OP stuff out right now, but they are doing it in a way that is absurd… like the Ka-52 gets modules but the prem Ka-50 only months later? like wtf? Or how broken was the 2s38 or the obj 279? thats all not to long ago and they dont stop doing this sceme, so there is no change to this behaviour.

its shit and drives people of the game, or how do you explain the shitton of reports that address this and also the not increasing playerbase? Its not because its fun to get wiped from smt u cant do shit against. I would say this (any many more) is an issue that should be addressed. And one solution could be a tank only mode. but as i saied… why should they? nothing to sell there that cant be sold in the combined battles… and the argument that cas would lose worth… well tanks would gain it back so…

and about the “prem does not get changed so bad that u cant play the prem anymore” … if i buy a prem or even multiple to play a certain BR… and they change some of that in BR … u think thats fine? Well i really disagree… if i buy smt i have bought it in this excakt state. If the surrounding change, thats okay… but changing my F1 Car to F2 while i also bought 3 other F1 cars for the same race is bullshit. Changeing it to make it balanced, thats fine… but changing BR or even Rank… thats absolut assmove… and with talis… i buy a shit ton of them and also a shit ton of these tali vehicles got extremly changed in BR or even rank… one good example is the F9F… i have grinded with it… bought a tali for it cause i liked it… then they changed its rank one rank lower and did i got any compensation for it? no. Or the T20… was rank 3 on 5.3… not its rank 4 at 6.3… i build a whole prem deck with multiple vehicles around it… now i can only use a few of them anymore as they are not vialble at 6.3… there are bazillion examples for this and i dont think its fair or even consumer friendly at all. I wouldnt wonder if its even illegal and if u go in front of court they would have atleast a discussion about it, at least here in germany. As all u buy in a Video game is “geistiger eigentum” and changing it so u cant use it for the intendet purpose of the buyer, is generally illegal… how for u can go here idk… but i remember in WoW was smt similar in front of court and Blizzard lost back then and needed to refund.
But that dosnt matter… at the end its super consumer unfriendly how they handle it.

3 Likes
1263

+1 to additional tank only mode, make it a nice little check box under the battle mode selection - fanks

4 Likes
1264

@bertgame 4 for 4.
image

1265

bump
gaijin add tank-only gamemode it will take 5 minutes to do this and you know it

2 Likes
1266

Oof, that will require that CAS haters get good at the game first XD

2 Likes
1267

[quote=“FrankenFact, post:1251, topic:216490, full:true”]

Your opinion, which cannot be said of all players, thus a fallacy. Many players do not want to “enjoy” CAS, they want to fight ground vehicles only. I know: “Mind Exploded!”

Putting in a TO game would not harm the devs one bit. It may harm the players who like CAS as they will have less targets to shoot at, but there is always ARB or AAB they can play.

7 Likes
1268

this is one of the most trivial to disprove theories ever

1 Like
1269

So you would have no issue with player controlled SPAA being added to the air gamemode, right? I mean surely this wouldn’t cause any issues since SPAA isn’t that good against planes… Which would mean they aren’t that good in ground… Hm…