Bring back the Coelian/Flakpanzer 341!

You just described the German Spirit perfectly.


And the Removal of the 3 German Tanks betrayed said Spirit, exposing the decision as a racist, biased, hypocritical, bigoted and unfair Corporate Move.

you are breaking so many logical fallacies rn, im not gonna believe ya just cuz you say it is true.
the side skirts are not the reason for its cancellation. the Panther III was designed to be more heavily armoured as is clear from the increased thickness of the UFP, the cancellation was true but not du e to any reason that you have stated.
plus your phrasing was very poorly worded and gave the wrong impression

Are you saying it makes no sense that the Germans would be interested in stopping Russian anti-tank projectiles?

The Panther II project was initiated because the panther was originally vulnerable to the Russian 14.5 mm. With the addition of the side skirts, the Panther was no longer vulnerable to the Russian 14.5 mm,. The Panther II was intended to be a much more armored panther, but that was no longer necessary so it was canceled.

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The Panther II project was started because, even before the Panthers made it to the Eastern front, it was believe they were not armored enough, particularly against soviet AT rifles such as the 14.5 mm when shooting at the side armor.

Afterwards it was realized that the side armor of the Panthers could resist the 14.5 mm with the simple addition of the side armor skirts. So the major reason as to why the Panther II even existed in the first place had a much simpler solution that did not require making a different tank.

That is indeed the main reason why work on the Panther II was stopped.

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i makes no sense that they WOULDNT want to stop russian HEAVY MACHINE GUN fire. which is what you said.

see the bold word **prevented ** above?
yeah, probably a mistake but thats what you said

again, a wrong ASSUMPTION. the panther II was cancelled because the German high command didnt feel it was adequate. they didn’t grow out of the need for armour though since they immediately started work and used the blueprints of the panther II in the E-50 standard panzer project

He literally did not say that.

He said, much like I have said, that the Panther II project was dropped because the much simpler solution of putting side skirts on the normal Panthers worked for stopping the Soviet 14.5 mm AT rifle.

Not a mistake, it is just my comment. The side skirts of the Panthers did prevent the Soviet 14.5 mm AT rifle from penetrating the side armor.

Keep in mind you said this:

At this point I’m 90% certain it’s less a case of me and him choosing our words poorly and more a case of you just not knowing how to read English well.

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not just me, another also got the wrong impression. hence wording

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And did I ever disagree that the Panther II’s side armor also prevented the 14.5 mm from penetrating? No, I did not, and if you read his reply, he also isn’t saying that. Again, this is a case of you not reading English well.

The point is that the side armor skirts that are fitted on Panthers also managed to accomplish the main goal of stopping the Soviet 14.5 mm AT rifles without needing to make a different, more expensive, heavier and unnecessary tank.

This is not a hard concept to grasp.

No one did and i never claimed you disagreed.
You misunderstand again bro.

But that was not the reason for cancelling the p II. the reason was its inadequacy. They still neede more armour thats why they went to try the e50

Not really.

The Panther II project was similiar to how the Tiger II appeared only a few years after the Tiger.
Hitler wanted to be his tanks to be a step ahead of the other nations so the plan was to built a new tank and already plan the next one that was going to replace it.

The Panther II was suppose to have as many parts interchangeable with the Tiger II as possible, to lower costs and increase productions. Which would have been the same transmission and tracks.
The idea was very similiar to the E-Series of tanks.

The main reason why the Panther II was canceled was most likely:

  1. The Panther II of the time didn’t offer enough improvments over the production Panther
  2. Slowing down Panther production for a new model was most likely not feasible

At the time, the Panther II would have basically be just another Tiger I with almost the same weight and power to weight ratio.


Armor is meant to prevent penetration. It’s not a mistake. The side skirts prevented penetration. It’s that simple.

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I hope you receive discliplinary actions on this forum. Regarding the Italian planes, may they return to the German TT also, Vehicle Ubiquity is Universal. But I personally prefer Ground and the 3 German tanks are each unique. So they are my main point.

I haven’t checked this thread in a long time, but its nice to see that it devolved into yet another “much panther 2” thread that I’m sure we all wanted

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Please elaborate.

A good part of the posts in this thread just took the concept, talking about the FlkPz 341 removal, and used it to have a discussion about the viability of the Panther II

Ah, they are all equally important in my opinion. But fair critique.

Germany-Ostwind 2
USSR- Yak 141
Japan-Ho-Ri(all series),R2Y2(all series),Kikka,F-16AJ

Yeah sure gaijin do their ‘WORK’ very well how nice

XP-38G was removed, just like the fake German vehicles.