Bombs destroyed after beeing dropped

Game Discussion Realistic Battle
106

So… not really the same? I don’t think anyone objects to a bomber high-ordering and vaporizing because a fuel tank explosion chained over to the bomb bay.

What annoys people is when a bullet hits a bomb IN THE AIR after it was dropped, and in some cases that bomb then chain-detonates not only other nearby bombs but sometimes up into the plane’s bomb-bay itself. It seems unlikely that high-ordering under those circumstances has EVER happened. Except in War Thunder.

(Dudding a bomb with a lucky bulletstrike while falling? Sure I’d buy that. It’s the high-order explosion, as if the bullet could make the fuze initiate, that is strictly “rule of cool.”)

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107

I’m more puzzled about how a APHE shell detonation in the middle of a SPHs HE shells often dose not cause them to detonate, but a single 7.62 AP round hitting a bomb seems to have a 100% chance to detonate it.
Not that I don’t enjoy watching A2Ds vaporize when they try to CAS you, but they do seem too sensitive to low cal. bullets.

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108

And by a .50 cal mg. I mean - COME ON!!!

There’s no way that happens with even a fraction of the occurrence it does in WT.

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109

It looks like the code for this feature works something like this: if there is any ordnance within X km of the explosion center (the distance probably depends on the TNT equivalent), just detonate it as well. The result is that when you drop, for example, 10 bombs with a heavy bomber in Ground Arcade (where you basically spam bombs because you have very limited time to drop them and usually a few fighters on your tail), if any bomb that has already been dropped or is still in your bomb bay gets hit, it will detonate all of them.

My guess is that this mechanic was created to make bombers weaker, since many players complained about them. Personally, I don’t think such a mechanic is needed. It’s also completely unbalanced when a good player uses SPAA with a proximity fuze - in that case, enemies can’t drop any bombs at all. The first nearby explosion from a shell or missile will detonate everything: both the bombs already dropped and the bombs still attached to the plane. The opposite situation is also possible - if you manage to destroy, for example, the first bomb dropped by a bomber, it will cause a chain reaction, detonating all remaining bombs one by one, including the ones still attached to the bomber, which of course destroys the bomber as well.

It’s also possible to destroy rockets the same way, but in Ground Arcade people rarely use rockets, so it doesn’t happen often:

I don’t know how it works in Ground Realistic, since players behave differently there, but this mechanic has completely broken the balance in Ground Arcade. Especially at some BRs, bombers are now pretty much useless.

I recently played the PGZ09 and WZ305, and in many battles I was able to completely block enemy bombers - they couldn’t drop a single bomb for the entire match, which is just ridiculous. That’s not how a balanced game should work.

2 Likes
110

By the way if people were looking for hard stats on the issue(some applicable tests are discussed in Chapter 5 & 6), they can be found in the following document;

TM 9-1300-214, Military Explosives

Having read through it it seems that the each type of explosive has “some chance” of detonating due to shock, it’s nowhere near a certain occurrence(~30%), and should only detonate if the resultant energy (post casing penetration) is above some floor value.

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111

well correct me if I’m wrong but isnt 50cal also used in some cases to detonate unexploded bombs etc from further away, or it was actually used.

But that 7.62’s and even smaller bullets detonating em is kinda hilarious

112

It is but it’s normally Raufoss rounds, not ball ammo. And only if other methods of controlled detonations proves untenable.

.30 call ammo can, it’s just not common, and mostly to do with one of the more shock sensitive booster / initiation charges being struck, or incendiary compounds causing deflagration or it to burn up.

113

it also happens in ground RB and naval arcade as well, in the latter mode planes, esp. bombers are most forces to suicide attacks (ridicoulos strong ai aa) and its very annoying if the bombs dropped never reach the target

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114

Yep, as I remembered. And yes didnt think they would use AP rounds for that, but I would assume hitting trough metal case, it might cause enough heat to ignite it .

But in game , they sould really change it that it needs to be least 50cal to detonate them,

Nothing is more fun compared to get 1 shot by 5mm machinegun in sturmörsser

115

So just for easy reference, here’s the results of the bullet impact tests from that ref, which involved firing a bullet into a pipe bomb containing the explosive material:

Explosive Bullet Test Result Notes
Nitrocellulose 100% complete detonations “Never handled in quantity in the United States”, 460% as sensitive to TNT, comparable to mercury fulminate/lead azide
RDX Great sensitivity (but doesn’t detonate: partially deflagrates instead)
EDDN Partial detonations with bullet velocities >1000 m/s
Haleite 60% partial explosion, 20% deflagration, 20% unaffected
Nitroguanadine Unaffected
Ammonium picrate 30% partial deflagration
TNT Rifle bullet detonation was only possible at 105-110 C temps “Insensitive to rifle bullet impact at room temperature”
Ammonium nitrate “no explosions”
Amatol Unaffected
Composition A3 “no initiations”
Cyclotol 30% detonation, 30-40% partial explosion, 30-40% unaffected
Composition C3 40% partial explosion
Ednatol 7% ignited, no detonations
Picratol 40% ignited, no detonations
Tetrytol 10-55% “partially affected” depending on %tetryl Tetryl/TNT mix
Tritonal “More similar to Tetryl than TNT”
Amatex 20 6% partial detonation, 3% “burned”
HBX-1 75% of TNT
HBX-3 80% of TNT
HTA-3 90% “explode”, 10% “burn”
Torpex 100% partial/complete detonation
DBX 49% “exploded”
Nitrostarch “explosions do occur”
Dynamite “relatively insensitive”

Note you’d really need a high-order or “complete” detonation for a bomb to behave on bullet strike like it does in game, not just a deflagration (catching fire) or a partial detonation (aka “low-order”).

Another source to consult would be OP 1664, US Explosive Ordnance (1947), which gives the “bullet initiation score/value” as tested for US WW2 explosives, with 100 being "cannot explode from a bullet hitting it and 0 being “always explodes when a bullet hits it”:

Explosive BIS/BIV Notes
RDX (pure) 0 “much too sensitive to use alone”
PETN (pure) ~0 Only suitable for detonators
Torpex 48 “insensitive enough to stand all normal handling”
Pentolite 48 “cannot be drilled”
DBX 51
Tetryl 61 “too sensitive” for use in ammo main charges >20 mm
Tritonal 64
Tetrytol 65
Composition B 79 “might be detonated at low order by bullet impact”
Ednatol 83
TNT 100 “capable of standing bullet impact”
Amatol ~100
Explosive D >100
Composition A >100
Composition C >100

So the short version there, from primary sources, would be while the kinds of explosives used in detonators and primers can be sensitive enough to explode when struck by a high velocity object (as everyone who owns a gun with a firing pin knows), explosive compositions typically used for large high explosive charges, in particular TNT, CANNOT be high-ordered by a solid bullet up to .50 cal under anything like real-world conditions, even ignoring the low likelihood of hitting a bomb with the bullet.

The difference there (and they normally use waterjets on EOD robots for this, not guns) is you’re trying to disrupt the fuzing mechanism by knocking wires loose, etc. so that it DOESN’T high order, not hit the explosive.

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116

Well, seeing a dropping bomb from a km away in combat conditions would be a difficult thing. Actually hitting one with a pintle-mounted .50 cal would be quite extraordinary.

Could something like this have happened during WW2? Possibly.

But keep in mind, there would have been formations of bombers dropping a lot of bombs, and a battery of aa guns firing up at those formations. Sure, of the 8-16 guns firing at 8-16 bombers, there might have been an occurrence.

Now reduce that to 1-2 guns firing at 1 bomber. IMO WT increases the probability of “success” by a factor of 10.

1 Like
117

I feel like this would incentivise kamikaze bombing more, when you fly directly at a target and drop bombs, they can take them down and save themselves. This mechanic would mean you can just crash into them and drop bombs at the last minute without fear of the bombs getting destroyed

118

maybe but thats much more realistic as destroying nearly every bomb then the plane is doomed

119

The thing is that a sympathetic explosion is not the only potential outcome of a bomb getting shot. It could alternately combust, or simply dud.

Which has the same effect for a ground vehicle as the current system, while not causing so many issues for aircraft.

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120

Twice per battle is more often than in the entire WWII.

I asked ChatGPT:

Is there any evidence that during World War II an interceptor or anti-aircraft gun struck and detonated a bomb just dropped by an Allied or Axis bomber? Did such an explosion ever trigger a chain reaction among the other bombs from the same drop, destroying all of them and possibly the bomber itself?

Short answer

No.
There is no documented case in World War II where anti-aircraft fire or an interceptor hit and detonated a bomb that had just been dropped, and no case where such an explosion triggered a chain reaction among other bombs and destroyed the bomber.

And the physics make such an event extremely unlikely.

1. Why dropped bombs almost never exploded in mid-air

WWII bombs used safety mechanisms that prevented detonation immediately after release:

  • Arming vanes/propellers needed several turns before the fuse became live.
  • Some fuses required a set time, distance, or impact force to arm.
  • Right after release, the bomb was not yet armed.

So firing at a falling bomb in the first seconds after drop was basically a waste of ammo.

2. Even an armed bomb is very hard to detonate by gunfire

High explosives used in WWII (TNT, Amatol, Torpex, etc.) are shock-resistant.
A bomb only detonates if the fuse triggers, not if the explosive shell is hit by fragments.

So even if Flak fragments hit the bomb:

  • Hitting the fuse directly at the perfect angle would be required.
  • That’s statistically near impossible in a chaotic air battle.

Mid-air detonations of WWII bombs did happen, but they were always due to:

  • defective fuses,
  • accidental collisions between bombs,
  • premature self-detonation,
  • or damaged bombs before release.

Never due to AAA or fighters striking a falling bomb.

3. Chain reaction among multiple bombs?

No real-world evidence. Zero.
And physics are against it.

Reasons:

  1. Bombs from a bomber are separated by tens to hundreds of meters, not packed close.
  2. A bomb explosion’s shockwave in open air loses power very quickly.
    Beyond 20–30 meters, it won’t sympathetically detonate another bomb.
  3. To set off a second bomb, you must hit its fuse, not its casing.
    A blast wave in free air doesn’t do that.

Historians found no reports in:

  • RAF Operational Research,
  • USAAF bombing analysis reports,
  • German Flak documentation,
  • Ordnance disposal records.

4. Did bombers ever lose bombs that exploded in mid-air?

Yes — but not due to enemy hits after release.

Known real causes:

  • bombs colliding with each other after release (rare),
  • bombs with defective fuses exploding shortly after drop,
  • bombs damaged inside the aircraft before release.

These incidents sometimes damaged or destroyed the bomber —
but that’s internal ordnance accidents, not external enemy-induced explosions.

5. Did a bomber ever get destroyed because its own dropped bombs exploded?

Yes, but only when the explosion happened inside the bomb bay.

Documented cases include:

  • incendiaries igniting inside the aircraft,
  • “cookie” blast bombs with faulty fuses,
  • bomb bay fires detonating ordnance.

But again:
Never “bomb dropped → enemy hits it → bomb explodes → chain reaction → kills bomber.”

That scenario appears in movies, not in actual wartime reports.

Conclusion

Historically: No evidence.
Technically: Extremely unlikely.
Operationally: Never observed.

However, it did occasionally happen that bombers were hit by bombers flying overhead. I haven’t managed to do that in WT yet.

In summary, I am in favor of abolishing this nonsense.

6 Likes
121

I’ve done this numerous times as well as many people.

122

So i’ve read all this I can say that:
1- bombs shouldn’t do chain reactions.
2- bombs shouldn’t explode from low calibers (maybe 30mm can be the lowest caliber needed for said detonations, planes should stop “ammo rackin” bombers so commonly but SPAA should still be able to defend their teams by precise aim).
3- This should only happen on certain types of explosive fillers.

5 Likes
123

Bombers with bombs explode like fricken nukes. You try to do your part and you get blasted in your face with an explosion. This is especially bad in Assault. It’s not enough that there is a cluster of AI shooting at you, but often you end up losing your plane due to this crazy explosion. Even if it’s not the bomber you were shooting, but someone has blasted another one with a rocket and your plane loses control.

3 Likes
124

No, it shouldn’t - in WT it shouldn’t happen at all.

There is exactly ONE piece of evidence of an a/c blowing up from a flak hit on it’s bombs that I know of -
image

This is identified in a couple of places as FLAK hitting a 4000lb HC “Blockbuster” carried on a Lancaster - see Flak | Ted Church - Tail End Charlie

So it is a thin-walled bomb apparently struck directly by a heavy flak shell that detonated on impact - not bullets or shrapnel or light flak hitting a GP-type bomb that has much thicker walls

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125

well thats better for me since I hate when bombers act like water ballons.

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