Begleitpanzer 57 to 10.3 like the 2s38

I think 1.0s reload alone would be 11.7 worthy.
I think giving it Delta 6 alone would be 12.0 worthy.

But giving it both may just be too powerful imo.

Fair enough.

Yes.

Yeah, I guess we’ll just have to wait for more decompression to come around.

I think it would be quite similar. I mean, they’re both 57mms, but I think the 2S38 would have the better round / velocity (and therefore penetration) due to the gun’s design.
The Bagel has a better firerate though, which is 0.3s instead of 0.5s.
I think they’d be just as good as one another.
2S38 gets better acceleration, reverse speed, a somewhat invincible turret, and gun elevation, whereas the Bagel gets an ATGM (which is kinda useless past 10.0 to be honest), better gun depression, and slightly better armour.

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Yeah it’s hard to know without trying it out first, it’s always easy to revert back reload speed changes if it’s too OP.

That’s interesting. I’ve seen people post videos of them not being able to lock helicopters that are much closer than 5-7km, even with photo contrast mode.

Agreed.
Bagel with a dart should be a direct counterpart to 2S38.

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Maps actually affect how far away you can launch the missiles.
From what I can remember, IR lock can depend on the temperature of the map, so it’s easier to lock onto helicopters on sands of sinai than artic base etc.
And optical lock can depend on the weather (like if it’s thunderclouds etc).

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Are you sure it’s not the other way around ?
I guess engines should appear “hotter” when the outside temperature is lower.

I’ve heard it only works when they have clear sky as a background, otherwise it gets pretty funky.

So all in all, it’s still pretty inconsistent.

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At the same time, cooler temperatures mean that the engines are cooler in general.

Yeah.

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With APFSDS, 10.0 would be too low. 11.0 would be fine.

As “mid” as the 2S38 and HSTVL.

10.7, but yeah. TOWs only make it slightly better than 2S38 if both have APFSDS.
Of course I’ve personally yet to see evidence of APFSDS for Begleit.

2S38 is not 10.0, it’s 10.3.

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Aren’t engines supposed to operate at a certain temperature for various reasons in all conditions, with cooling system being in charge of keeping that temperature in check by increasing/decreasing flow of coolant through it’s core ?
If this is true, engine core and exhaust gases pushed into the surrounding air (if exhaust pipe is short enough) should have pretty similar temperature regardless of the environment.

I guess that’s better than nothing, most IRs struggle to lock past 3km which is nuts.

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Well, I’m not sure exactly how they had implemented it, but I know (based on experience) that colder environments tend to make them harder to lock on with IR missiles.


They had also changed how they are picked up on thermals, so maybe this also affects their thermal signature levels for the IR seeker too.

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I’m not really familiar with their coding either but that seems counter-intuitive, at least in my eyes.

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ok?

hmm…

i would advise you to scan the rest of this discussion or similar discussions, then
you’re in the germany discord, we have a whole thread on this.

ykw here you go

Not enough to be noticeable.

For traditional radiator controlled engines, your thermostat will be cycling the same temperature fluid once it’s up to temp unless it’s so cold outside it can’t get/maintain the thermostat to open fully, or so hot that the radiator is in over temp regardless of OAT

For Turbine engines, they’re mostly. Maintained by some sort of engine control module that keeps them running at about the same temp most of the time.

The only real difference will be the difference between them and the surrounding conditions.

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You are more or less correct. In cold weather a IR seeker will be more effective. WT has just badly implemented / coded them, especially in regards to non HIRSS equipped helicopters.

  1. Thats the only point i get with you, but tbh with HE-VT it is only about a few skill to easily handle it the same as the 2s38
  2. Still even Top Tier US (Clickbait) hasn’t get gen. 2 thermal
  3. As light tanks both a most comon oneshot, while the german BG-57 has its engine in the front, which protects the crew and tank if ur lucky 1-2 shots
  4. seriosly? this thing is more useless than mine protection addon lmao

I agree with Razerguy.
Give apfsds to the begleit and up it to 10.3

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still not as good as 2S38 as no gen 3 thermals, no irst, no tracking, and no swim

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Begleit should at least move up to 10.0, it’s an excellent multi role platform, just like the strv9040b with a better ready rack.

I’d say 9.7 is more reasonable.
Unless it getz tandem ATGM to compensate.