Battle Rating changes for January 2024 (post feedback)

[ID_Heaven]

@Cpt_Bel_V

but the 2 last got denied before VTAS even reached a cockpit

Spoiler

[TyTheGuy27]

@FlipAllTheTables

It absolutely isn’t “decidedly worse” than the T25. It’s far more mobile and with the added stabilizer and faster reload I would much rather play the T20 at any BR compared to the T25.

Well, that’s just a case of preference. The T25 undoubtedly has superior armour and far superior firepower.

@FlipAllTheTables

It’s a great gun but the M36B2 is more a sidegrade to the M36 than anything. It makes a massive sacrifice in mobility in order to have HEAT

I’d disagree with the “massive” decrease in mobility, the speed is essentially identical and while it does take a hit in Hp/tonne ratio it doesn’t have a huge impact IME on mobility. It’s mostly balanced out by the roof armour alone. The access to HEAT is a huge advantage- the M36 can penetrate the majority of the vehicles it faces, especially with APCR. The M36B2 can penetrate every vehicle it faces easily, usually without needing to aim at weak spots.

@FlipAllTheTables

Both KwK 40 variants (L/43 and L/48) are worse in every way except reload, which is identical. The L/48 gets closer due to it’s longer barrel, but still fires a slower projectile, with less penetration, and with less damage.

The two are extremely comparable.
Here’s the penetration for their APHE rounds at 500m at 0 and 60 degrees:
M1: 133mm, 48mm
L/48: 130mm, 47mm
L/43: 123mm, 45mm
The L/48 is has functionally identical penetration to the M1. The L/43 has a bit lower flat pen but only a couple mils lower sloped pen.
While the M62 does have more filler than the PzGr 39, but both are sufficient to single-shot knock out a tank most of the time.

@FlipAllTheTables

The armor on Pz.IVs is poor, even on the Pz.IV H with add-on track armor because the majority of the turret is still just 50 + 15 mm effective.

The turret is thin, but it’s also relatively small. The hull armour with tracks is quite good, protecting the Panzer IV from centre-mass shots from most guns it faces at its current BR.

@FlipAllTheTables

Overall the M4A1 (76) absolutely has better armor (due to turret, hull is similarly effective on both tanks), better mobility, and far better firepower as not only is the 76 mm better, even if only slightly, it also has a .50 cal and a stabilizer.

I agree except for the 76mm being significantly better. That’s why I’m not asking for the IV H to be the same BR, but .7 lower than the M4A1. Instead of the same BR as vehicles such as the M4, Cromwell, or M24 as it currently stands.

@FlipAllTheTables

Since you compared the Fireflies to the M4A3 (76) you should also mention how they have poor gun depression (only -5°) and nowhere near the same amount of mobility, on top of slower reload (keep in mind they only have 5 ready rounds). Also I certainly hope you aren’t including the Comet in there with the 77 mm gun.

The difference in reload isn’t a huge deal, nor is the depression. A vehicle that trades dramatically increased penetration (172/59mm at 500m, see above for M1) for decreased post-pen and moderately decreased mobility doesn’t deserve a whole 1.0 BR lower. Especially when that means vehicles such as the KV-1 L-11 or standard M4s are expected to fight this beast. Again, I’m not arguing for the two to be the same BR, but .7 different.
I was including the Comet in the vehicles that I believe ought to move up, as it has excellent speed, great firepower, and a trolly turret. It’s probably the vehicle I believe has the least qualification for an increased BR, but it’s a lightly armoured vehicle with minimal reverse rate which is the category of ground vehicles I struggle the most with so I gave it the benefit of the doubt.

@FlipAllTheTables

SU-100

Fair points, but I find the lower profile and improved forward mobility of the SU-100 and especially its hull traverse and reverse rate make the SU-100 actually better than the Jagdpanther overall. Certainly it’s a lot more similar in design and performance to the Jagdpanther than Panzer IV/70.

@FlipAllTheTables

The M4A1 FL10 seems like a great vehicle, but the M4A4 SA50 has a much longer reload, 9.75 to 7.5 seconds depending on crew, and has much worse mobility, due to the 4 ton higher weight.

The ARL-44 only has good armor specifically on the upper glacis, everywhere else is mediocre at best, the mobility is also mediocre, and the reload is 10 to 13 seconds, which isn’t exactly “decent fast-firing”.

The FL-10 is a great vehicle. The M4A4 SA50 does lose the excellent autoloader, but it gains a bit more survivability (especially the turret) and access to the POT-51P round with 180/61mm penetration. This is one of the most powerful shells at the BR, and closer in (flat) penetration to the KwK 43 than the 76mm M1!
The ARL-44 has a decently protected turret, with 110mm armour. I find it blocks more shots than its stats would suggest. And 10s is quite fast-firing when you compare it to other full-calibre weapons with similar penetration around the BR, such as the D-25 and D-10. I don’t see any reason this should be the same BR as the T1E1 and lower than an IS-1 or Tiger H1.

[AlvisWisla]

Just notch…
That’s the thing, R-27ERs don’t have a no-escape zone.
R-73s do.
Mig-29G & SMT are 12.7, so they’d have to be moved to 12.3…

[AlexaMcDowell]

@AlvisWisla

Mig-29G & SMT are 12.7, so they’d have to be moved to 12.3…

BRUHHHHH so they can have the oportunity to face 11.3 nope

[Lord_Prism]

Ah yes what a fair argument to the most OP SARH missile in game being at 12.0 “Just notch”

I really dont know what youre trying to argue here but you are a known troll so IDK.

Remover the ER from both the 9.12 and the 9.13, give them the R73 and move them to 12.3

[AlvisWisla]

That’s why I oppose Mig-29 9.12 and 9.13 from getting R-73s, that’d just be 4 12.7 Mig-29s with no changes.

@Lord_Prism R-27ER is not OP, it’s a SARH.
“OP SARH” that still hasn’t killed me this year cause I know how to defeat radar missiles.
No. Mig-29 9.12 and 9.13 should NEVER have R-73s. Russia should never become OP.

[Downtown1]

Kindly make APCR better performing. The fact that APCR is unable to penetrate angled armor is rediculous.
Furthermore make HESH better, too many times I’ve seen it just not do anything.

[CodyBlues]

A lot of bad changes on the list. They seemed to only have listened to the loudest whiners on the forums.

Things like the A-10 not going up, the G.91Y/YS not coming down.

The mig-29G going is a bit weird to me since we all know AMRAAMs are gonna drop any minute.

All F-104Gs should have come down, and the F-104A/C should have gone up.

[Morvran]

@Stona_WT

Harrier GR.7 — its Battle Rating will increase to 11.7 in SB. This change was supported by your feedback.

That’s gunna suck with no Radar but, fine. At least it won’t be against 12s

[CodyBlues]

They are gonna add more F-15s, that’s why it’s not getting it.

Just like how they added another MiG-29 to Germany with R-73s.

[FriesingCold]

Honestly, I kind of think until a mid range 29 like the 29S (9.17) is added, the 27ER should stay on the 29 (9.13) where as for the German 9.12 I would whole heartedly agree to have that changed, as it would likely keep its same BR and become a definitive dogfight platform, as it only really performs well in a close range dogfight now.

Now for what I’d like with regards to all 29s and sub variants.

What I would love to see is in this order, (9.13 with R73 and base R-27s (9.17 foldered in after with R73, 27ET/ER ) then following that folder the 29SMT (9.19) all in the MiG line.

In the “Yak line” (now the naval aircraft line) following the Yak-141, is the MiG-29K.

[CodyBlues]

Because it got complained to not go up by the loudest group.

[TyTheGuy27]

@AlvisWisla

@TyTheGuy27

MiG-29, MiG-29A add R-73/E, remove R-27ER/ER1

No, I prefer them at 12.0 instead of 12.7.

They’d still be fine at 12.0. R-73s have only FoV gating IRCCM, which is only really effective at close ranges and side aspects. It’s rather simple to reliably flare with sufficient situational awareness.

[Morvran]

Also new SB brackets suck. Still no 11.0 top tier bracket but now 11.7s are DOA for 2 brackets instead of just one.

Any chances of getting tornado F3/ADV down to 11.3 where they belong.

Also no changes for F4J(UK) or Mig23ML in SB.

Also why is the F15 not moving. Easily 12.7 capable.

[Macekeeks]

char 25t still going up wow m82 shot at 8.0 funny gaijin really funny joke

[Mytho-GR1]

@Morvran

Also why is the F15 not moving. Easily 12.7 capable.

No HMD and maybe a skill issue on American mains part

[Morvran]

Yeah, they need OP aircraft ofherwise ithey have to under BR their stuff. Why the F5C is still way too low

[CorporalApollo]

Tbh I really think it belongs there, it essentially has the Gripen loadout (9M’s with unlimited flares) and thrust vectoring, fantastic at dogfighting.

In sim good GR.7 pilots are DEADLY as they can locate targets wit their RWR

[Khomuna]

Really? No F-15 going up? Every other top tier jet was raised.

[kcns]

have you tried flanking?