Eh, it was optimized for a different role. so it makes some sense that the AV-8B has worse performance since it trades it for more stations and lift capacity / fuel, the USMC had other airframes (and the Navy) to rely on for the A2A mission set.
its always been the AV-8 and not the FV-8, so we made it better at its actual job which means the plane is better.
in what respect, thrust to wieght is about the same if not better for the AV-8B
Top speed and high end acceleration are worse with the Big Wing, as well as when fully loaded due to being able to carry more, relative performance is worse.
so an AV-8B+ with a couple AIM-9’s and certain combat radius will be a worse dogfighter than a Sea Harrier with the same amount of AIM-9’s and same combat radius?
yea the harrier 2 should perform worse than a harrier 1 as a fighter.
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do you know empty weight for the sea harrier vs av-8b+?
google says the AV-8B+ is only 500 pounds heavier empty but that does sound kind of low, you would think it would be like 1000lb
it has a significantly more powerful engine so that would make its ttw much better if true. with a far more advanced wing it should be a better dogfighter at the cost of some top end performance
Its not just weight, its also drag. bigger wing = more drag
Mk106 vs Mk107 isnt that big of a difference.
Just using WT wiki for this
Mk106 (FA2) = 9’290 / 10’040 kgf
Mk107 / Rolls-Royce F402-RR-408 (T10/AV-8B+) = 10’020 / 10840 kgf
So its about 800 kgf difference.
The difference between F-15C and F-15E in comparison is around 2000 kgf
Bigger wing designed for more hardpoints and greater warload weight =/= better in a dogfight.
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i know the OWE weight of a GR7 harrier is 7050kg, but i dont know about a harrier 2 with the radar mounted, dont know shar weight.
not really that more powerful.
slightly mininformed in how the wing was better. It had active flaps like on a hornet to improve performance at low speed (not in game), a lot more hardpoints (US harrier 2s are missing two) and LERX but overall it was a bigger bulkier plane that wasnt made as a fighter primarily
much more advanced wing though, and mk106 vs 107 is a 2,000lb thrust difference
none of the harriers really were, even SHar was a strike jet modified to fulfill a small fleet defence role
the weight difference is far bigger and there are 2 engines, its just a different scale overall so not that comparable, its like me using the difference in thrust between 2 cruise missile engines to make 106 vs 107 seem earth shattering
In what way?
Though less advanced than the GR5/7/9 wing though if I follow what I think your logic is
sea harrier is a navalised gr3 harrier for the most part, couple other changes in some places but ultimately its the same V/STOL medium-weight fighter meant to operate from anywhere. became much more of a strike craft with GR3 upgrades. very much a fighter with bombs more than multirole
harrier 1 was a lot more fighter-centric in its conception than harrier 2 was, to the point that harrier 1 punched extremely above its own class, harrier 2 really didnt in comparison for the times
doesnt gr5 have less composite and a worse leading edge extension than the AV-8B’s or something?
Might not have the full LERX, but still had the 8 hardpoints (4 per wing)
strike aircraft*
wasnt the outrigger pylon thing mostly a limitation imposed by the USMC to keep things safer
I thought you lads made [The Office] so much better, instead of Harrier.
Sea Harrier [F] RS.1, [F] A.2
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became one. Wasnt one initially.
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he said
implying the gr3 was a medium weight fighter
We navalised the Harrier because we want a medium-weight fighter.
In the role of Yak-38 or F-35 Lightning II
thats literally what harrier was designed to be. before being evolved into also being able to do the ground attack recce role.
Shar was purpose built as our naval air superiority fighter to replace spey phantoms. keeping the attack capacity from GR3 was an additional capability. (most of the gr3 goodies at least)
however we still used GR3 for bombing runs over FRS1 in the falklands.
its not a light fighter in the way of a hawk mk100 or mk200.
its not heavy like a phantom or tonka.
its a medium weight fighter
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