Yes it is but still off by a Landslide at high Speed
Despite the recent Nerf mostly adding drag at top Speed
December stats on Statshark dropped
And let me guess su30sm2 great but still lacking behind the rank 8 euro deltas
And the Americans being horrible?
true but i do know it was never a made to be a fighter aircraft its just was made as a mostly ground pounding aircraft
New 14.3s by winrate:
SU-30SM2: 53.9%
Rafale M: 52.5%
J-10C: 50.2%
EFT-AESA Germany: 49.0%
F/A-18E: 44.9%
New 14.3s by K/D:
SU-30SM2: 1.35
Rafale M: 1.12
EFT-AESA Germany: 1.02
J-10C: 0.99
F/A-18E: 0.71
Surprisingly the SU-30SM2 is doing the best out of all the new 14.3s (ignoring the minor nation EFTs)*.
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Surprised the Rafale m is worse than the sm2
The 30sm2 has a very bad vertical coverage. I have to roll a lot for situational awareness.
Stock grind
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I think we will see more definitive conclusions to be made in February once January stats drop.
Rafale M is in the same boat since it was added alongside the SU-30SM2, and still is doing worse statistically. Mind you, the Rafale M is being played by minor nation players while the SU-30SM2 is being played by major nation players, so for the SU-30SM2 to still have higher statistics is quite a bit of a shock.
Rafale stock grind is far more miserable, that’s what I meant.
Edit: Nevermind, they moved micas to tier 3 in the rafale M, the OG is still tier 4.
Then I don’t know, but in my experience the rafale is the better jet, and easier to get higher kill counts with more consistency and also better survivability if you play aggressivelly. Also the radar will pick up much less missiles which helps to find the actual targets you want.
I have notched missiles with the SM2 by just tracking them with TWS ahahah, but its annoying when you want to lock people instead and there are many missiles in the air
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Indeed thats why i think the Rafale is Miles better
Ps but the stock grind on the su30 Isnt to bad given
You have the r27et and r73
Mirage 2000 with SB controls is much better at pointing it’s nose at low speeds due to being able to reach and sit on 29 AoA limit. It is a decisive advantage in low speed fight when compared to RB counterpart.
I have actually re-tested this with a wider variety of people. I am inclined to agree with you that the Su-27 is pretty heavily favored to win against anything that isn’t the F2A or some form of Eurocanard fighter. Even something like the Rafale ends up being roughly equal in sim and comes down to who can aim better at low speeds.
Yeah, the Su-27/27SM seems to be slightly better than the gripen in a dogfight.
Full controls on RB is the same thing. Am I wrong? The mirage 2000k is one of the jets I switched to full controls quite often, even on normal matches
Here is an answer to the original question. In short…yes the Su-27 is overperforming when compared to it’s book values. I have had to extrapolate the sustained turn rate graph in the manual, convert IAS to TAS in order to calculate turn rate, and then create a new chart that is still indexed to IAS.
It is a little bit difficult to discern with everything overlaid on top of each other so we can just look at the 3000m turn rate figures.
The relationship between the 3000m figures is going to be similar to figures at all altitudes. First off the planes STR is overperforming across the board. It is off by around 1/2 degree per second at it’s close figures when compared to Statshark; however it should be noted that the Statshark estimation for the Su-27 is probably underestimating the turn performance by .5 to 1.5 degrees per second as well depending on the speed range.
Here is an example of testing the Su-27s STR at minimum speed with damping enabled. The calculated turn rate is approximately 21 degrees per second. The Stat-Shark number is roughly 19.5 degrees per second at this low speed. The variation however may be explained by decrease in altitude or decrease in speed.
The Statshark numbers are close enough that I do not feel like adjusting them or applying some kind of blanket correction to them. For instance I tested the STR at 1000m and at 330kph IAS and the tested number matches the Statshark number.
The 330kph IAS number equates to 17 degrees per second in testing at 1000m while using the Su-27 loaded to reference weight of 20,000kg. This is approximately 1.5 degrees per second more than what the manual indicates the plane is capable of.
The other area of notable over-performance is going to be in high speed sustained turn rate. You can clearly see here that the amount of turn rate error pretty drastically increases past 1000kph IAS. This is something that is not uncommon for other planes in War Thunder like the Rafale.
Basically Su-27SM is now a certified “baby-plane” that pushes S key and wins against everything else that isn’t in the baby plane category.
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thought id add to this forum seeing the statshark came out for december and uhh… yeah
russia has a significantly higher WR in realistic top tier air, with the highest WR vehicles of the BR being both the SU30s. Not to mention their some of the only few aircraft with a 1+ K/D AND K/S. This isnt really a standard deviation… especially when you look at sim
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I think that can be partially explained by redfor sim players generally being fairly high skill compared to blufor ones because of how dominant blufor was/is in different sim BRs.
As for RB, the Rafale finally has a competitor, and I’d consider both equally good. The Typhoon is still a bit behind because of its worse flight performance and loadout (Aim-120 seeker buff when gaijin).
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maybe like 1 or 2 years ago i can see this, but these days? Not really
The “RedFor players are highly skilled compared to BlueFor players” meme is something that was predominantly true about a year and a half ago when the F-15C + AMRAAM + Double Scan Radar Bug was the rule of the day. And this meme largely only applied to a handful of players vs perpetually spawning F-15 hordes.
This really is not the case today in my experience. The introduction of the Su-30SM and fixing the radar bug was the start of a pretty noticeable shift in the sim community in regards to top tier. A few things have happened. A lot of USA-only players or players that used to predominantly play USA have just quit playing the game. Another not-insignificant subsection have switched to playing on the “red” side because the planes are now predominantly better. This has been turbo-charged by the addition of the Su-30SM2 and buffing all of the Flanker flight models, and adding premium Su-30 variants.
What this is doing right now is creating the opposite environment of what we had 2 years ago. The average guy is going to get stomped when they attempt to play USA and most middle of the road players will default to Russian planes at top tier because they are unequivocally better for all intents and purposes.
Right now if you attempt to play blue side planes…you will be outnumbered by 2-4 players…and most maps are multipathing slop like Denmark. Your choice right now is to take USA planes with flight models that are not competitive to new Flanker FM…and the reason you would take them is to have a working RWR. If you take something that is competitive like the Eurofighter or Rafale…it is likely that by the 2nd or 3rd time you spawn that your RWR will stop working and you will have to rely purely on MAWS to notch and chaff missiles.
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Its interesting that RWR bug has gotten to worser stage at this point in sim, that its actual affecting more at times than before and targeting certain frames. Not sure why devs are not getting this fixed immediately?
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Flankers have ruined gameplay