- Yes.
- No.
- As a researchable vehicle
- Researchable vehicle, foldered with Surbaisse.
- As a premium vehicle.
- As an event vehicle.
- As a squadron vehicle.
- I voted no.
Hello, today i’d like to suggest a third french vehicle that utilizes the 120mm SA46 cannon, that being the AMX-50-120; the older brother of the Surblinde and Surbaisse tanks!
HISTORY
It all began back in 1945, when AMX introduced the “Project 141” vehicle, and an order of two vehicles has been placed. Later, it was renamed/received the index of “M4”. The vehicle was made under influence of the Konigstiger (King Tiger, Tiger II) and Panther designs, and was classified as a “medium” tank at first.
By the end of 1946, AMX presented a new tank destroyer prototype - with the AMX M4 base (although lenghtened to 9 road-wheels) being used as the chassis for the tank destroyer. It’s mass should’ve been around 58.5t, and it should’ve used a 120mm cannon and a MAC Mle.1931 machine-gun. Although this particular vehicle didnt even leave the drawing board, the project later evolved into the Foch. In this very project, French engineers utilized their own version of the American T53 cannon
In 1949, the first blueprints of AMX M4 were made. They used a conventional turret design, featuring no autoloader, but retained the same cannon. This later was declined in favor of an oscilating turret, aswell as an autoloader, due to the concern of engaging multiple russian tanks at once - such task would be overwhelming especially for the loader.
In 1950, AMX was making a new concept of the M4, this time with a different nose/frontal part, aswell as a “lighter” turret. During this time, multiple new concepts were made, with weights ranging from 50,5t all the way up to 70t. The vehicle was ultimately rejected, however, in september 1950, AMX introduced another project - with the only thing inherited from last projects being the turret, inside which, engineers proposed installing a 120mm cannon.
From just these drafts, we can already see that the 120mm cannon there is different from the one on tank destroyers. Unlike tank destroyer versions of it, instead of utilizing a composite barrel, it used a monoblock barrel, much like the T53. The new turret was proposed to be mounted on the AMX M4 chassis, however it was decided that to mount such a turret on the chassis, the area near the turret would need to be wider.
The project of a “lighter” turret was quickly abandoned, but not for long. The engineers returned to it in June of 1951, and, it’s worthy to note that during this time, the second prototype of AMX-50 (with the increased hull width of 3400mm!) was going through trials. And, after weighing all the “yes” and “no”'s, the project of a “lighter” turret was declined.
However, the rejection of it didn’t apply to the mounting of a 120mm cannon. Later, the development of a new, bigger “oscilating” turret has begun - with the purpose of mounting a 120mm cannon. Of course, it was developed by FAMH. AMD presented the first draft design of the turret, designated T.O.A.120, a year later, in June 1952. The turret of the second prototype AMX 50 was taken as the basis for the design, which was slightly enlarged. The total height of the turret was 1685mm (1.685m). For comparison, the height of the original turret was 1.26m. The aft niche became longer by more than 0.6m, and the total width reached 2.84m (2.48m at the original turret). The diameter of the “hole” in the hull for the turret in the light (production) was 2.32m, and the weight of the turret was 20,260kg (20.26 TONNES!). A simple calculation showed that even with the current weight characteristics of the chassis, the total weight of the tank should have been at least 58-59 tons. The height was no less impressive – 3.5 meters, that is, more than that of Pz.Kpfw.Maus. And with all this, the tank was still designated as a “medium”!
The first prototype of the AMX 50 with a 120 mm gun was manufactured in 1953. The hull of the vehicle was the same as the one for the 100 mm cannon versions, the same applies to the rest of the units. The combat weight of the still “medium” tank according to the documents was 59.2 tons. The ammunition included 50 rounds, of which 18 were inside the turret. There were 6 shots in the mechanized, revolver-type loader.
ARMAMENT.
AMX-50-120 utilizes a heavy 120mm cannon alongside an autoloader. You’re probably familiar with the cannon - it’s a very hard-hitting cannon with a round that produces enough spall to reliably destroy most enemies with one or two shots. The HE round can be used to even overpressure not only light tanks or anti-air vehicles, but even some medium tanks/early MBTs! The TOA120 turret also uses a 20mm MG/151 autocannon mounted on top of the loader’s cupola.
The 120mm cannon has the elevation of -6° and +13°. The 20mm had the vertical limits of -5° and +80° (as the cupola is the same as on Surblinde.)
AUTOLOADER.
AMX-50-120’s autoloader is different from the ones used by AMX-50 Surbaisse/Surblinde. Instead of it being only in the rear of the turret, it’s instead placed in a drum below the breech, and also in the rear of the turret (bustle). The drum stores 11 rounds, while the bustle stores 6, and 1 on the rammer tray. This gives AMX-50-120 a superior reload compared to it’s brothers (Surblinde/Surbaisse) of 5s, which is absolutely amazing for a tank with a 120mm cannon!
ARMOR.
The hull armor for AMX-50-120 is the same as on AMX-50 TOA-100, 90mm front, 40mm on the sides and rear. The turret armor, however, is different. It’s 55mm of armor at a 55° angle, giving it around ~100mm of effective armor in the front. The armor on the sides and rear of the turret is 40mm, while the roof has a weak protection of 20mm of armor. So armor is not your best friend with this vehicle!
MOBILITY.
The mobility of the vehicle got worse with the increased weight, which is now 59.2t (compared to the old 48.4t). The engine stayed the same; 1000hp with a power-to-weight ratio of ~20.7hp/t, 5 forward and 2 reverse gears. Yes, your max speed has stayed the same - 50km/h forward and 20km/h reverse, but you’ll accelerate much slower than the default AMX-50 TOA100, so your playstyle will have to change from the one you’d normally use while playing AMX-50 TOA100!
CONCLUSION.
In conclusion, i belive that AMX-50-120 would be a great addition to the french tech-tree, adding a yet another tank which utilizes a 120mm cannon to it. It’d also be a great substitute for Surblinde, as a lot of people don’t have it, and are growing tired of using the Surbaisse.
SPECIAL THANKS TO:
@Uitli for helping with the suggestion.
@Colasix for the documentation.
PICTURES, TECHNICAL DATA AND SOURCES!
Source for history section: Долгая дорога в тупик | Warspot.ru
AMX 50 — Википедия
ALL INFORMATION WAS TAKEN FROM CHATTELERAULT ARCHIVES (AA 503 1H1 50), MUCH THANKS TO @Colasix !!!
AUTOLOADER BLUEPRINTS/DOCUMENTATION
