Add STOCK CHAFF FOR BR 13.0 +

Game Discussion General Discussion
21

I totally disagree, the only thing you learn from flying without chaffs at 13.0+ is how to deal with frustration.
G suit, chaff and hydraulic actuators are extremely basic items and are extremely essential.

Without these 3 items it is impossible to perform evasive maneuvers in a timely manner.

flying low only you are still subject to taking splash damage from missiles and some fox1 like the r27 can still hit you, only multipathing is not reliable.

These 3 items are basic and essential.

But the ideal would be for the planes to come with their entire air-to-air kit already released and with these basic items( chaff, g suit and hydraulic actuators) and the rest being researchable.

It’s very unfair that I face an F15E/I with 8 ARAAMs while my stock Mirage 2000EI has no chaffs, G Suit, hydraulic actuators and the 2 Micas that come with them take an absurd outrange to the AIM120… I’m simply an easy target, besides affecting the plane’s statics.

The stock grind mechanics are not enjoyable…
Just like the crew mechanics, you pay 300k sl + 1kk sl to make the crew expert…it’s ridiculous
…and if I had to pay only once it would still be acceptable, but if I move a plane from crew to crew 2 I need to pay AGAIN the 300k sl +1 kk sl of specialization.
All these mechanics are slot machine mechanics, they only serve to extort your money through frustration…
Ground RB people suffer even more with these mechanics…
You have to spend GE to have the maximum crew limit, with crew number 10 costing 1800 GE, you have specifications that do not apply only to the vehicle but to the vehicle and that specific crew, and the same for the training cost, in addition to the stock grind.

all this is a real myth of sifos simulatior.

The cost of crews beyond 5 should not exceed 500 or 800 GE, the specialization and use of the vehicle should apply to ANY CREW MEMBER WHO HAS THE NECESSARY LEVEL FOR.

It doesn’t make any sense that I have to keep paying all the time.

2 Likes
22

Sounds like a siill issue to me, fam

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24

your argument is as deep as a saucer full of water.

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25

Such is the depth that warrants such a non-issue

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26

mediocre…
I bet you are main USA and must be American too.
To not understand irony/sarcasm is to be incapable of interpreting a sentence, you must be American

27

Wrong and wronger. Also xenophobic xd

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28

Minimum Abort Range.
Imagine a radius around a plane. If you fly inside that radius, missile will kill you even if you go cold. The horizon of that radius is called MAR.

That’s the thing. You are not supposed to fly inside that radius in BVR fight. You are supposed to give your missile better launch parameters than your enemy (high and fast), crank, hold TWS or STT lock as long as you can and go cold before you exit MAR. Then recommit as fast as you possibly can (when you think you defeated the enemy missile). You don’t need chaff for that.

29

That is good information, and I will keep it in mind when I unlock top tier Germany somewhat soon.

With my second comment, I was mostly referencing 11.7/12.0 planes that end up facing AMRAAMs with very limited longer range capabilities, such as a stock(ish) Mig-23 vs an F-14 IRAF.

30

F-14 radar is quite bad (in War Thunder). The PD won’t track you in cold aspect and loses lock easily when the enemy starts notching. The Phoenix A is also technically not an ARH missile. It is a SAHR until it’s within 16km, only then it turns its internal radar on.

It’s very easy to get inside the kill box just by notching and staying low. F-14 can’t see you at low alt in SRC mode. When you get inside 10km radius, just launch R-27T and keep notching. It’s the single most effective method against F-14. I aced the crew on MLA that way.

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31

Just WOW the very “intelligent” sKilL IsSuE crowd came out the woods on this one. So let me burst your bubble a little.

JUST NOTCH BRO: That’s a very good idea, the only problem is that what exactly are you going to achieve with just notching without chaff? If you didn’t know Pulse Doppler (PD) radar, as the name suggests, uses the Doppler-effect to differentiate between moving and static radar signatures. This is why you can’t simply chaff a PD radar since the radar is smart enough to know that if it sees a stationary target and a 1000 km/h moving target then the stationary must be the chaff, and the moving is the plane. The act of notching is to turn perpendicular to the PD radar thus removing your specific velocity component which would cause the doppler-effect, this causes your plane to appear as a static radar signature, blending in with the chaff, thus fooling the PD radar. However, if you just notch without chaff what are you going to achieve??? Your will make yourself look like a stationary target, but without chaff acting as other targets the missile is simply going to target the only radar signature in its line of sight, YOU! This is an equally idiotic take as saying that you can dodge an all-aspect IR missile, by turning into it. Like sure, you made yourself a less hot target by presenting a front aspect but if you don’t deploy flares to act as hotter/more appealing targets then the missile is simply going to target the only IR signature it can see, YOU!
JUST MULTI PATH BRO: Multipathing is a very unreliable way to counter radar missiles for two reasons. One: usually the three heights on most maps are higher than the multipath height, thus making it impossible to do, unless you want risk crashing (three hitboxes are bullshit in this game). Two: even if you find a patch where you can actually hit the deck, the technique is not always successful. Sometimes you still get a direct or a splash hit.
At the moment there are only two reliable ways to defeat SARH/ARH missiles without chaff: Turn around and bleed the missile or find a mountain/valley and fully brake line of sight for the radar. Both methods produce passive gameplay and denies you precious time and positioning.
I understand Gaijins motivation behind the module grind, however you can’t lock basic fucking functions behind a module. Modules are supposed to be performance upgrades, not basic functions. Imagine that your stock tank can only use gear 1 and 2 and you have to research the “transmission” upgrade, or the “afterburner” upgrade, or the “airbrake” and “thrust vectoring” upgrade.

2 Likes
32

I agree. Also chaff should be buffed to have higher RCS/speed, to reduce the notching window needed to blend with it (idk if this is the right word)

33

A stock plane doesn’t have a large enough supply of fox-3s to play that high altitude tit-for-tat game of BVR combat vs spaded planes. The spaded plane will take a longer ranged shot vs you to put pressure on you before you can enter your idealized launch range. This forces you to respect the missile and abort your approach LONG before you can reach a superior higher/faster position to shoot. To say nothing of the fact that you don’t have the engine/compressor/flight surface modifications that are critical for reaching that superior position first.

You turn away to kinematically evade, and they keep coming since you don’t have the missile supply to afford send something their way to keep them busy. Then they close within range where you will need chaff to survive an attempt to turn around to shoot back, and eventually they close enough where they can just shove a missile up your tailpipe.

Your logic is completely backwards. Until a plane actually has the tools necessary to seriously compete at high altitude BVR combat, namely chaff AND enough fox3s to afford to spend some at longer ranges to pressure the enemy, stock planes are better served by playing like a rat that lives within multipath height so that they can advance within pitbull ranges and jump people with missiles launched DEEP within the MAR where the opponent cannot have time to make any evasive action in time.

1 Like
34

and you are not supposed to get hit at all in a tank in theory, therefore we should take off fpe and parts altogether as stock mods because you dont need to repair if you never get hit
theory =/= reality, especially so in wt

35

It makes zero sense to not simply have chaff by default as it is required to be even vaguely competitive, similar to not having flares at these BRs. Active radar missiles won’t even care if you’re notching a lot of the time if you aren’t also dropping chaff

36

That’s what terrain masking is for until you get chaff, which is a tier one mod for all rank VIII planes anyway.

It’s not supposed to be easy, that’s why it’s called “grinding”, everything else is skill issue

37

Garbage take

Having to grind in order to be competitive is bad. All planes should get their best A2A loadout, G suit, chaff, and new boosters stock.

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38

But at the same time, chaff isnt a magic button. Someone who doesnt know how to kinematically defeat missiles, or how to notch or how to multipath is gonna dump chaff and die.
They’ll learn the lesson anyway, even with stock chaff

39

I know how to play without chaff. It isn’t a competitive playstyle in any shape or fashion and relies on you playing extremely conservatively. It’s also map based as there are maps like golan heights where you are not going to terrain mask. You have no reason to defend this but you’re doing so probably for contrarian reasons.

40

The hills on the east side of Golan allow for terrain masking, and you can also go towards the sea. Sure, you’ll habe to play less aggressively for a few matches, but shouldn’t be very many assuming you pick to research chaff as your first mod. My point is that this is a non-issue

41

fox 1 and fox 2 only mode ?