Add-on track armour for italian ww2 vehicles

[bobbyre]

[Would you like to see add-on track armour for italian vehicles in-game?]

• Yes
• No

I would like to suggest the possibility to add track armour to some italian tanks and tank destroyers, as previously done by onemax9000 in the old forum (Add-on armour for Italian tanks - Passed for Consideration - War Thunder - Official Forum).

During the war in nothern Africa, the overall obsolete italian armoured units were forced to try and improve their survivability by adding spare tracks (and sandbags, but even rocks!) on their tanks, in particular on the front of the hull and casamate, in a desperate attempt to reduce the effect of allied 57 and 75 mm guns at long distance.
No vehicle, to my knowledge, has the option to use sandbags and I can see the reasons behind the decision, I am not suggesting that. Track armour, instead, is implemented on a variety of ww2 vehicles, whether as a researchable module or stock.

Italian tanks and tank destroyes are known to be a little fragile at their current level, as was historically, and this addition would provide the italian vehicles with a little benefit in armour at the expense of a little mobility, already poor, giving the players the possibility to adapt and change their playstyle, this will surely not change the overall capabilities of their vehicles; for what I can say we are talking about 20 mm of maximum track armour (less efficient than RHA), nothing extraordinary.
Since we have already in-game some vehicles that probably entered in service exclusively with the German Army (75/46 M43, for example), I considered photos of captured italian vehicles in German hans too.
I found some photo, but I will gladly add any additional one linked on the comments below. Many thanks to ImportantSimone5 for the many additional and important images.

L6/40

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Two L6/40 in German Service with side track armour and probable frontal hull (we can barely see the silhouette of the track in the snow, but unsure).

Italian L6/40 with limited additional tracks on the front of the hull.

Semovente L40 da 47/32

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Semovente da 47/32s with tracks added on the front hull. Probable German Service in the Balcans.

M13/40 & M14/41

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Two photos of the same M tank (some sources say M40, some M41, if someone can tell the difference please help) in Africa, with extensive track armour all around the turret, on the frontal casemate, and over the transmission.

M13/40 or M14/41 with limited track armourd in turret and over the transmission.

Knocked-out M14/41 in nothern Africa with limited track armour over the transmission.

Carro Comando Semoventi M42 and one M13/40 or M14/41 with frontal track armour. (provided by ImportantSimone5

M15/42 - All from probable German service

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Two photos of a M15/42 in german service with rather limited side track armour.

A bunch of pictures of a group of M15/42s captured by yoguslavian partisans (star painted over the cross in the turret in the tank behind the pylon), with track armour around the turrent and at the side of the casemate, with minor differences.

Maybe the same occcasion as above but with extensive spare tracks on the frontal hull, casemate, side casemate and turret.

A badly damaged/destroyed M15/42 with half the barrel torn away but limited frontal hull and casemate track armour and track lins on the cheeks of the turret.

Semovente 75/18 M40/M41/M42

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Spare tracks on the frontal casamate (maybe a buried vehicle).

75/18 completely covered in spare tracks, sandbags, fuel cans and junk.

Sandbags with spare tracks on the transmission.

Two photos of the same group, with spare tracks on the frontal casemate and on the transmission.

A Carro Comando M40 in foreground, with tracks on the transmission, followed by some Semoventi with tracks on the hull.

A Semovente 75/18 M42 in german service with track armour on the front and the side of the casemate.

Semovente 75/34 M42

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A disabled Semovente 75/34 in german service, track only on the frontal hull.

Sources

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Beutepanzer (Archive)
Beutepanzer
Panzerwrecks (Publications)
Atlante Mondiale dei Mezzi Corazzati, vol.2, Nicola Pignato, Ermanno Albertelli Editore.
I mezzi blindo-Corazzati italiani 1923-1943, Nicola Pignato, Storia Militare.
Carri Armati nel Deserto, Valerio Naglieri, Ermanno Albertelli Editore.

[Spr4yz]

This is a great suggestion. With the Italian tanks being historically thin-skinned to their contemporaries at the time it makes sense they would try and up-armor them which should be reflected in the game as well, because it would help balance them since the same weakness is demonstrated in the game.

[LamawDoniczce]

Concrete could be added to the Stug 3, because some German crews poured concrete over the entire frontal armor

[LamawDoniczce]

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[ImportantSimone5]

You forgot the track armour on M13/40.

[Exocetta]

@LamawDoniczce

Concrete could be added to the Stug 3

Concrete haz bin shown to not provide any meaningful protection against AP or HEAT. But it looks cool. I hope when they add a Finnish STuG its the one slathered in concrete from the museum.

[Spr4yz]

In war thunder concrete has a x0.35 multiplier so it does offer some protection.

[EddieVanHalo]

Good Idea. I enjoy playing as Italy about 4-5 BR

[Exocetta]

WT also says you can cartwheel off a cliff and drive away just fine…

[karnitin75]

what does the wanky physics engine have to do with it

[Exocetta]

I just thought it was funny. The same way wood has an RHA equivalent or piece of sheetmetal can have a 1000mm RHA in WT.

[Spr4yz]

Well, I figured if it pertained to the game and with the framework the devs are working within it would actually have a purpose. It’s a game, that’s what I treated it as.

[Охраняет-Камни]

Iirc there is some issue with a use of too many polygons by Italian WW2 tanks because of multiple bolts and that’s why we don’t have add-on armor for them in the game.

[Exocetta]

If the dev’s purpose is to create are realistic-y game, then its purpose would be to have marginal benefits (slight protection) to cost (much less mobility). Still talking about the concrete BTW.

[Spr4yz]

That statement isn’t wrong, but what I was getting at is that gaijin has already added concrete to the game (Naval), and Naval armor values are usually very similar, if not the same, as in Ground most often.
True, you never mentioned how it may perform in the game specifically. But that led me to want to add that it would be beneficial as it is now in the game, as your comment seemed to be a bit dismissive about it and not many people may know that it exists in the game already.

I can’t speak for gaijin or what their method or what they’re doing is correct, but judging by the available information and how the game typically works, concrete seems like it would be viable (in the game).
Hope I get my point across and you understand what I mean. :)

[Exocetta]

By “viable” you mean provide a game play advantage? If it is modelled historically correct, then it won’t. It won’t provide any meaningful protection for the loss of mobility. Like take that “x0.35 multiplier” at “face value” (get it?), do the math and you need literal feet of concrete. Do a little more math and you see how many tons of added weight that is.
The only reason it should be in the game is because its historical.

[bobbyre]

I put the M13/40 and the M14/41 together, many sources are quite vague whether is one or the other, and in many photos I can’t tell them apart. If I find more accurate indication I’ll expand the section.

[ImportantSimone5]

Ok fine.

[bobbyre]

I really hope it is not the case, it would be pretty sad.

[BangDing_Ow]

A solution could be to make the bolts 2d textures when the add on mod is installed
Or maybe it isn’t, I’m not a 3d modeler.