Game benefits ,you and me benefit from little bit more realism
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Relying on a skill issue to survive is exactly why your planes are getting blown out of the sky.
You SAW one shell.
At the end of the day, these are cannons made to blow BOMBERS apart
Why should your fighter be tanking these rounds??
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No, No we do not benefit from needing to hit fighters even more than we already do. bring evidence that the .50s are overperforming and not just your educated guess because “it was a 1974 study, not a 1942 one”
Those are 88mm flak cannons holes. Why are you comparing them to 20mm cannons? No duh 88 Flak is going to blow these things apart.
My problem is that Cannon fire is heavily overstated in it’s strength
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The last photo is 100% not a flak cannon hole.
If 20mms were that powerful, half these planes should have gone down within the first one or two shells. they may have gone down later, but according to warthunder Physics, just two of these rounds should split bombers in half. But in Real life as we see. They get utterly peppered by them and still stay flying to some degree. But in War Thunder they are able to magically snap these guy’s wings with little effort.
That’s a damage model issue, not a 20mm issue. You also need to remember pilots in WT are much more accurate compared to real life.
Currently bomber damage models are quite weak, and they die easily.
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Exactly this, guns are far more accurate in war thunder than in real life. across both air and ground.
If they need to fix damage models so be it. But accuracy should be a moot point when in war thunder you just need to hit your target around 2-3 times to split the entire tail off while these pilots were literally raking them with their 20mms. Even if they missed a few, enough has hit that according to war thunder they should’ve imploded.
Yes. Damage models are an issue, but what is getting me is that enough people have basically taught themselves that a plane exploding into chunks from a singular 20mm round is realistic. Not only that, the damage discrepancy that .50s and 20mms have are absolutely massive with the current DM of both the guns and planes is insane.
I think I stated before, but the Fuselages are for some reasons weaker than the wings?
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This will hurt your .50s too, because its also not realistic for 1-2 .50 rounds to hit an engine and immediately burst it into flames. The fuselage damage will also do next to nothing as well. Be careful what you wish for, dude.
20mm cannons are not made to blow bombers appart or Germany wouldn’t have made 30mm, 37mm and 50mm Mineshells, nor would the US put a 37mm into a planned interceptor, just like the Russians did with their MiGs, planned to intercept US bombers.
Just like how 20mm cannons turned out to be very inadequate as AA guns unless you could pump up the volume of shells by large amounts, since one hit was simply unlikely to take out even a regular fighter, while the chance was massively increased with calibers of 35-40mm that also increased the range to hit targets by quite a lot.
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Some fuel and engine fires, ammunition explosions, and pilot kills doesn’t sound too bad. Add a lot more internal modules for the aircraft that can be damaged, like they did with tanks recently. Not only that, going from the combat reports of P-47 pilots, some made kills of up to 800 meters away with their .50s. Yeah, they may not rip wings, but being peppered and having everything turned inside your plane to swiss cheese still doesn’t sound good.
I wouldn’t have a problem if the game changed to have damage more consistent IRL
oh well my fuckin bad. The guy isn’t talking about specifically 20mms or anything anyway. Still, you get my point.
Well you quoted the part where he said a La-7s 20mm will take his wing off in a single hit.
And 20mm cannons on a fighter vs. fighter basis is pretty much the norm.
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They totally arent already unrealistically overperforming… Yes, certainly not…
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So you think .50s should be even worse? Why?
I mean it works like bs RNG for somehow lmao
No, Shvak literally 1-shots planes.
I got 1km sniped while doing 550km/h by Shvak. I like to watch replays and 1 shell happily travelled this distance and ripped my wing in half. Fw 190D9 wing, mind you.
Hispanos are also overperforming.
The least overperforming of all is MG151/20 M-geschoss, which is still hitting a bit too hard (mostly because tail.parts of planes are way tok fragile). But 3 hits to the wingtop of P-51D and it’s still attached, although black - it makes sense.
Consistent gunnery is an important skill. Landing 1 shell is often a matter of spray and pray.
Single 20mm shell should have extremely low chance of causing serious damage.
Yet in game a single FI-T shvak hit from 1000m away can and will cripple your plane beyond any chance of fight or escape.
Now, a bit off topic - Shvak FI-T, with current game logic, has zero business even reaching 1000m target in a tailchase.
It weights 90g and is fired at roughly 800m/s.
M-geschoss with like 3 times the drag (because it’s based on real world performance and not made up numbers) weights 92g and is fired at roughly 800m/s.
M-geschoss will get literally OUTRUN (assuming the self destruct no one asked for wasn’t introduced) if you fire from over 700m at a target in a tailchase if you’re both going 550km/h. By the time it gets close to the enemy, enemy plane will a be going faster, especially if we consider added distance due to firing the shell in a very high arc, to even get anywhere close. In other words, at over 700m your shell, even if gravity wasn’t an issue, will basicslly fail yo catch up with the enemy. And since gravity is an issue, you have to lob the shell at an arc, which further increases the distance travelled, which further increases the time, which further increases the drop. Basically at around 700m you have no chance of hitting anything with M-geschoss at this speed, and your only chance are APHE, IT and API shells.
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It may very well be 37mm flak. Or 30mm mine-shell. It’s not 20mm, which will blow a 50-60cm hole if the planets align just right, but that’s it.
50-60cm hole in a fighter is a lot. But still you need a few of those to bring it down. In a bomber - it’s mostly superficial, hence you needed over 20, and that’s usually because with 20+ hits either tail controls got shredded, a fire started, pilots got taken out or 2 engines were out.
Meanwhile Shvak out of kinetic energy and with like 6g of TNT rips entire wing apart on a very sturdy fighter.
IRL it would make some holes from fragments, but since 6g TNT won’t get them to any crazy speed, these fragments will not penetrate a lot.