Wishful thinking with F-15C golden eagle

[KMS_Bismarck]

120c5 needs speed to be useful
Speed ​​will improve your survivability in BVR. BVR aircraft with 14.3 have high airframe performance, while Golden Eagle has only 13.7.

[KMS_Bismarck]

Golden Eagle will be better in 14.0

[Code_649]

@KMS_Bismarck

120c5 needs speed to be useful

No… what it needs is altitude. Once you’re up to Mach 1.3+ which the F-15C is capable of the difference in time to target (everyone shoots at <= 40 km anyway) is basically the same across all modern ARH missiles. The only missiles you genuinely need speed for are the R-77 and MICA because of their drag profiles.

@KMS_Bismarck

Speed ​​will improve your survivability in BVR. BVR aircraft with 14.3 have high airframe performance, while Golden Eagle has only 13.7.

The Hornet:
Su-30SM:
F-15E with ‘high airframe performance’ at 14.0:

[KMS_Bismarck]

Altitude allows missiles to fly farther, speed allows missiles to fly faster, and obviously faster is more important than farther.

[KMS_Bismarck]

The su30 can enter the 39th line faster, and the r771 has obviously strengthened this point, while the f15e’s radar is terrible

[CyrusJackson]

Amber Pylons: refused
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/w2MMzjNGpmkv

MRML pylons with primary source: refused
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/y3RoJmkAM9It
https://community.gaijin.net/issues/p/warthunder/i/TUQOAO0iCTyu

Meanwhile Yak-141 with paper feature and Su-27SM/Su-30SM getting double rack they can’t use in real life is fine. Great stuff as always.

[Code_649]

@KMS_Bismarck

Altitude allows missiles to fly farther, speed allows missiles to fly faster, and obviously faster is more important than farther.

Ackshually altitude does both. Or do you think the AIM-120s or any missile (even R-27ER!) fired near deck are also hitting and holding (while brief) Mach 4+ there?

[KMS_Bismarck]

Accelerate at 6km/h, not Mach 1.2 to 8km/h

[KMS_Bismarck]

Ignore /h Thank

[Demokrat4]

A completely useless aircraft, even worse than the dreadful Hornets. And this aircraft will be inferior in speed to all modern European and Russian aircraft.

[KMS_Bismarck]

Interchanging f15e and f15c ge would be a good choice

[Cooked_dough]

Agreed. The F-15C is originally a 13.7 BR vehicle, while the new “Golden Eagle” version was placed at 14.3 BR. If it doesn’t receive an increase in missile count, and only gets an AESA radar and the AIM-120C5, then it only suits a 14.0 BR. The performance of the AIM-120C5 in the game is not outstanding; its close-range performance is worse than the AIM-120A/B, and the C5’s maneuverability is not great. Compared to other 14.3 BR aircraft like the Rafale and the Typhoon, the F-15C is significantly inferior in both maneuverability and engine performance .

[_Renzo]

@Code_649

You can’t with one airframe in the F-15C GE:

• Have HOBS missile (C-5+ should, but I digress) similar to or better than MICA/R-77/R-73 without severely upsetting the balance (e.g., giving 9X that we know it can carry, but that’s basically every USA top tier jet)
• Insane amounts of thrust to ‘keep up’ with the other high-powered jets (no engine upgrades made to it)
• While decent manoeuvrability is there, it is not comparable to most at its BR (Su-30SM is equal-ish in that regard, just don’t get into a near stall or post stall fight)
• Have a decent radar and missile kit similar in performance to the heavy hitters (just not possible to get anywhere near them… unless I’m missing a key development of a 50+ G HOBS missile that isn’t 9X?)

The AIM-120C-5 is decent at range, AIM-9M are still good albeit lacking in effective range. The whole point of it was to give USA something with an ESA radar… which is what they said they’d do.

If it’s meant to bridge the gap with the current 14.3s than maybe it shouldn’t be 14.3? If it remains a sidegrade to the F-15E I don’t see why it should be above 14.0?

There are so many easy ways to make it more 14.3 worthy like giving it the BOL etc.

[Code_649]

@__Renzo__

@Code_649

You can’t with one airframe in the F-15C GE:

• Have HOBS missile (C-5+ should, but I digress) similar to or better than MICA/R-77/R-73 without severely upsetting the balance (e.g., giving 9X that we know it can carry, but that’s basically every USA top tier jet)
• Insane amounts of thrust to ‘keep up’ with the other high-powered jets (no engine upgrades made to it)
• While decent manoeuvrability is there, it is not comparable to most at its BR (Su-30SM is equal-ish in that regard, just don’t get into a near stall or post stall fight)
• Have a decent radar and missile kit similar in performance to the heavy hitters (just not possible to get anywhere near them… unless I’m missing a key development of a 50+ G HOBS missile that isn’t 9X?)

The AIM-120C-5 is decent at range, AIM-9M are still good albeit lacking in effective range. The whole point of it was to give USA something with an ESA radar… which is what they said they’d do.

If it remains a sidegrade to the F-15E

There are so many easy ways to make it more 14.3 worthy like giving it the BOL etc.

1. Sidegrade to F-15C*
2. BOL is likely

[Dead_Sky]

Needs FM rework (bug report submitted and accepted)
Needs BOL (bug report submitted and accepted)

Anything else would be an extra. Though, if it did get quad racks that would be perfect. 12 AMRAAMs would make it competitive but not the best fighter at that BR (obviously.)

And to talk about the person who’s calling it a stopgap, go and listen to yourself. It’s 14.3. If it were a stopgap, it’d be 14.0 and at its current state should not be more than 13.7. They went ahead and put it at top tier.

The F15E will likely be the better choice for air rb.

[themadseventeen]

Ngl if this plane doesn’t get better or more weapons or better engines I see no reason for it to be higher than 13.7

[Make_a_wish_kid]

@Code_649

A vehicle that doesn’t skyrocket to the top (or at least top 3) doesn’t make it DOA

A radar upgrade doesn’t make a plane 0.7 BR better

@Code_649

A possible 1000 CM F-15C shouldn’t be 14.3?

hell no, what are you smoking? The normal F15C has 240 CM and I rarely ever run out. Having 1000 would just be “nice” and not game breaking at all.

@Code_649

But the ESA-less Finnish Hornet with the same deal (bar flight performance in a straight line) is (or at least was considered to supposed to be)?

1. I never said anything about F18 should go up to 14.3
2. F18 doesnt need ESA radar. The current one that F18C has is good enough. You are not going to be flying 10km high and slinging aim120 at enemy planes 70km away because you can’t beat the current top dogs of BVR. You are going to fly low and fight opponents under 30km anyway. What use is it to detect enemy 50km+?

[Elijah1573]

@Dead__Sky

12 AMRAAMs would make it competitive but not the best fighter at that BR (obviously.)

I would rather keep the 8 missiles and instead have them fix the C-5 to actually have a notch resistant seeker
Imo there is no point in having a million missiles if they all are only viable against AFK targets in BVR

[Make_a_wish_kid]

@Code_649

Mach 1.3+ which the F-15C is capable

Yes it’s capable, but the gap between F15C and other planes like EF2000, F15E, Rafale, etc. is going to be big and you are going to lag behind a lot in BVR, you are going to fight a losing battle. That’s why those planes are at 14.3 and F15C isnt.

[Papa_Daniel]

@Code_649

You can’t with one airframe in the F-15C GE:

• Have HOBS missile (C-5+ should, but I digress) similar to or better than MICA/R-77/R-73 without severely upsetting the balance (e.g., giving 9X that we know it can carry, but that’s basically every USA top tier jet)
• Insane amounts of thrust to ‘keep up’ with the other high-powered jets (no engine upgrades made to it)
• While decent manoeuvrability is there, it is not comparable to most at its BR (Su-30SM is equal-ish in that regard, just don’t get into a near stall or post stall fight)
• Have a decent radar and missile kit similar in performance to the heavy hitters (just not possible to get anywhere near them… unless I’m missing a key development of a 50+ G HOBS missile that isn’t 9X?)

seems to me like you are simply describing the rafale, which had all these and more))

if the only change is radar it is simply a 13.7 vehicle at 14.3 and thus is DOA