An IDF video once said it was 80 tons. As far as I know, it’s the only source saying its that heavy. IDF does have a history of using buzzwords and whatnot to “twist” things to be different, despite not being so, example being with things like the ROEM 155mm SPH, where they said it was the worlds first “automatic SPH” or something along those lines. Unless more sources exist, I would not trust that, but that’s just in my view
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why can china, russia, usa and the 4 nations that get access to 12.0 leopards have tanks with relliable hull and turret armor while the least grinded nation in game needs to comfort with a big practice target? When you come across a T90, Leopard, ZTZ or Abrams you have to turn on your brain for at least a fraction of a second to avoid shooting at anythig that isnt the guntlet, turret ring or LFP. The Merkava already has the biggest LFP with the abrams and it also has the BIGGEST UFP. Also, you dont seem to mind that there is already a tank with the handling of the merkava and armor of a leo 2A7… well there is 2, the 2A7 and the 122+…
its not IDF. Both the ministry of defense and Rafael (the comany that makes the APS) say that a fully combat loaded merkava stay at around 66.5 tons…
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I don’t understand the argument that it was made for CE and that then excludes KE protection.
It was designed for both, as mandated in the Chariot project. Using advanced materials and design and is likely why it’s so heavy in real life.
That argument was POSSIBLY appropriate for 1990 tech and manufacturing. That’s 35 years ago.
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Merkava 4 is okay, imo still better than M1A2. At least you don’t lose your horizontal aiming after enemy looks in your direction. My biggest issue with Israeli top tier is that 99% of time we’re in the same team with America, and against Russia. Should I remind you, how bad lvl 15 Clikcbait players are.
No wonder Israel has the second worst winrate at 12.7, right after… America.
As you can see from my status card, after using Merkava up to this point, I would argue that Merkava is weak.
If you want to criticize me, you must have a higher Merkava record than I do.
What do you see in this game that makes you think it is based on reality?
Even if you could claim that the game is based on reality, there are parts of this game that are absolutely not realistic.
So I don’t think it is wrong to say that the game is bad and should be enhanced OR nerfed, even though it may be different in reality.
Merkava is in a position in WT where armor is suffering, so I would like to see armor strengthened. I don’t see anything wrong with this argument.
There is no doubt that to many civilians, Merkava = weak tank.
Only the designer knows the specific defensive performance of CE armor and KE armor, and since we are playing a game, there should be no problem if these values are increased or decreased slightly.
However, I think there is a limit to this increase or decrease. Although it is better than the Merkava, the Merkava is still thinly armored.
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America´s winrate is unforgivable. Having the second best tank in game with that winrate is just a skill issue. Merkava has paper armor, worse penetration and its lineups lack variety and a decent SPAA (the machbet isnt shooting anything down at 12.7) You can see how nations like Japan and France that dont have tanks with anything thats skill numbing relly on skill and have good winrates. Its the same with italy although it has a 2A7. What would make the merkava different from the leclerc other than the leclerc can be supported by a Rafale and a Ito 90? Also, I doubt anyone would grind Israel to get the merkavas. If they were the best tanks in the game, it wouldnt change anything, it would be an american lineup with prettier tanks and cooler camouflaged planes and also lacking a “decent” SPAA. Also, where did you get this numbers from? Is it from the forum or what? Im new to using these kind of things, IS there a war thunder discord server or something?
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They don’t better than Mav overall yes but not really second best probably second easiest tank to kill.
America´s problem is literally skill issue, go to 11.3 and all you see is clickbaits, the abrams is already very good. It has gun handling, penetration, mobility and not paper armor (at least in the turret). Israel has no SPAA (Althoug IRL it has the Spyder SR that could easily be added) and paper armor, and again, there is no actual reasons to grind Israel other than being israeli or really liking the merkava, the only difference would be that rare ocassion when you encounter a merkava at 12.0, you would shoot its lower plate or other weakspot instead of shooting anywhere to kill it
The M1 series and the Merkava series suffer from a critical issue known as “shoot the hull anywhere to kill” syndrome.
Dunno where this guy is getting “second best” when there are multiple nations sporting 2A5+ tanks and the BVM + 90M have existed for a long time now.
Im saying the abrams is second best because the Leopard is better and this wouldnt be a problem if literally 4 nations got 12.0 Leopards. The T90M and BVM have easy and relliable weakspots that usually kills or incapacitates them ( the BVM´s turret can be easily penned if not hit on the ERA) and they have the worse reload and reverse speed in the game. Although I hate playing against russia with Israel, if it wasnt for their CAS and my inability to stop it, I wouldnt mind facing T90s and BVMs all the time
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“Every tank have that problem including Uparmored Leopard it not something exclusive for Russia”
Mav MK IV deserve at least it pre nerf LIC turret armor at least i don’t see reason nerfed it to the ground too.
If by “reliable” you mean “seldom actually work because the autoloader catches all the spall” then yes. Compare that to an actual “reliable” kill being that you can shoot any merkava in the hull from nearly any direction and always kill the entire turret crew, and now with the M1 series basket change, you can easily kill the entire turret crew and disable everything present in the turret with a shot to any part of the hull. It is comically easy to do and only required the firing party to just fire into the general mass of either tank and you score a easy kill. Meanwhile for the BVM or 90M you have to hit either the LFP or the side, as the drive ports now more commonly do volumetric BS, or the mantlet only disables the gun due to the autoloader catching spall for the crew.
The Merkavas are easily the worst tanks at top tier bar the Arietes, which also suffer from having non-functional armor but can at least move. The M1s sit right beside the Type 10 in the middle of the pack for viability but are easily far from the top.
^
Yes, I mean relliable. Its very easy to kill russian mbts from the front, it just requires to shoot at the right places, this combined with the fact that they are small and cramped it just usually sends them to hangar or hinders them in a way that is just better to J out. The nerf to Abrams´ and Leos is good and deserved because not only they are the most seen and used tanks, they have relliable armor, best mobility and reload speed. Again Im telling you, 4 nations get 12.0 leopards, even sweden when it already has the 122s. It happens to me a lot that I blunder a shot but just my commander/loader is killed when I play the merkava. Tell me, wouldnt it just be easier to shoot the lower plate or turret ring to instantly ammo rack or knock my crew out by forcing the other player to target those weakspots instead of him just shooting the moment he sees a pixel of my tank?
We must be playing completely different games then.
So you just explained the average Merkava, Ariete, or M1 gameplay experience, shoot anywhere within the hull or just any pixel you can see of the hull to kill it. Anything below the turret ring on all of these tanks is a guaranteed 2 crew members at absolute minimum or the entire crew.
Meanwhile Leos have a armored nose pike and are immune there, while the entire UFP of the BVM and 90M are immune to damage. The 90M in particular is even more resilient due to it’s fuel tanks being spall shields and it having actual spall liners, most of the leopards have this boon only on side shots.
Such is not at all comparable.
Just like Uparmored Leopard and even easier on Abram case because just entire hull is green and easy to kill and who can’t aim hull?
The abrams has a lot of empty space next to the drivers place, the UFP can bounce and apfsds from time to time due to its extreme angle. the difference is that the abrams has very good turret cheeks unlike the ariete and merkava. There is not a single problem with the T90M being the most survivable because even if it survives one shot, it most likely cant out reload you or is left severely hindered. Absolutly no one should complain about russian mbts, all we see people talk about is the pantsir and the KH 38. The poing is, give the merkava 700-750mm of relliable turret cheek and UFP armor and thats it, it wouldnt change anything, literally, just make the experience less shitty for those who have proven their lack of intelect by grinding israel…
Uhhh no, the driver has two fuel tanks next to him encased in armor, which, if a round penetrates, generates additional spall. That is anything but empty space.
Unless the tank is on a positive incline and you are firing from the front no, not at all. That and it is extremely common for a round that does get deflected to simply bounce into the turret ring and kill the turret crew.
Like literally ever other tank in the game, except that the T-90M and BVM are far less likely to be successfully penetrated to begin with.
Wow, its almost like thats the same exact situation the M1 series finds itself in because when you have a barn of a hull, even if your turret is strong, people just shoot your hull.
Turns out that both tanks need their hull armor re-examined if they want to be actually relevant, just like how the Ariete WAR kit needs a serious buff.
Buddy it’s called complaining and everyone have a right to complain about anything especially about the Merks that suffer from being “Plastic” and huge inaccuracies, so from what you’re saying people shouldn’t complain and just shut their mouths, good point!
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And whats the issue with the T90M and BVM being more survivable? They are not even that good, they are slower, clonkier and have terrible reverse speed, they are cramped and have the slowest reload among 12.0 MBTs. Again, you dont seem to mind at all that you already have tanks with the survivability of a T90M and mobility and gun handling of the Merkava in the german, italian and swedish tech tree. If russian bias exists, it is certaintly not in the ground… or in air battles…