Why is there no M833 round in the M1?

[БЕИ]

@itango

Don’t take more than 15 rounds in the Abrams unless you’re feeling cheeky sniping.

I carry almost full ammo on all the Abrams, and I don’t give a shit

[Beeschurger]

@itango

The blowout panels don’t really do anything but yeah they are protected.

Surviving getting hit in the side and the main compartment not being penetrated and having your ammo cook but not explode is rare.

Even if I were to agree with you, ammo rack that works in 1% of cases > ammo rack that works in 0% of cases

[Beeschurger]

@rainy2000

What do you mean by this?

On Abrams, both ready and normal ammo rack are protected by bulkhead and blowout panels since theyre both located in turret bustle; compared to Leo 2 where only ready rack in turret is protected by bulkhead and blowout panel, while rest of the ammo sits in normal ammo rack in hull.

@rainy2000

though I can’t say that the Abrams doesn’t need to, especially if you only take the first-stage of 23 rounds.

oh absolutely, especially with the Abrams RoF, stops at caps to replenish ammo are also neccesary.

@rainy2000

any more than 23 rounds can cause ammo rack detonation with practically any tank at 10.7+ other than the 2A4.

sure, ammo rack detonations arent problem unique to the Leo 2A4 and even if you were to agree 2A4 ammo layout is worse than that of Abrams, its still miles ahead of Arietes.

Point I was going for is that with Abrams im much more comfortable taking more ammo than my ready rack capacity, which allows me to carry more ammo types for those once-a-year situations where I get to use them.

@rainy2000

Well, I was using the BMD-4, which has an alright firerate of 330, but it was using a 4/5 APDS belt (effectively only 264 RPM APDS), which is significantly worse than something like the BMP-2M’s 550RPM of pure APFSDS.

Same with the 550 RPM 4/5 APDS of the Terminator, or the 560mm RPM APFSDS from the 25mm of the Freccia, or 2S38.

Sure, no contest there, however my point was aimed at the fact that unlike with standard MBT cannon shot, unless the IFV nails the start of its burst perfectly, the target WILL react - not neccesarily firing back, but smoking and/or reversing into cover.

Im not denying BMP-2 at close (or at range shown in your clip) will chew through Abrams turret ring like its nothing - happened to me quite few times - but situation in actual game dont always present IFVs with large enough time window to burst down MBTs.

@rainy2000

and you will receive maximum spalling when shot in the turret ring by an MBT APFSDS round (which isn’t the case for any part of the Leopard).

Sure, I agree with the most part, but with MBT APFSDS, like 3BM42, which is pretty common at that BR, most shots into the Leo2 UFP will one shot it anyway turret ring weakspot or not.

[Necrons31467]

@rainy2000

You do realize if you take more than 22 rounds with the Abrams

Check the screenshots, both vehicles loaded with 25 rounds, which seems like a fair representation for what the average player brings to battle.
The opposite side bustle on the M1 is virtually empty.

@rainy2000

but 17 rounds of APFSDS (from my experience) is enough in most cases anyways.

Then why you even bringing up the previous point?

@rainy2000

I’m surprised you don’t know this.

You just worded it strangely.

Just say ‘‘The amount of residual penetration determines spalling’’.

Regardless, a vastly larger amount of frontal area of the Leopard 2A4 is weaker than that of the M1, you’re shooting yourself in the foot here.
Simply put: You’re guaranteed more post-penetration spalling by shooting the 2A4 randomly across it’s frontal aspect than you are with the M1.
Furthermore, maximum spalling is achieved quite easily and does not require in excess of hundreds of millimeters of penetration.

@rainy2000

Ah, so you weren’t talking about fuel tanks absorbing the APFSDS. You were talking about the extra armour behind said fuel tanks.

Both contribute to protection.

@rainy2000

The outer edges (to be fair both are roughly 30% of the LFP) of the giant LFP of the Abrams can stop the second weakest round at 10.7.

Tell me, what’s the most common tank (and thus most common APFSDS round) you’ll face in an M1 in your average 10.7 match?

@rainy2000

but its LFP is less pronounced than the Abrams’

Who cares?

The LFP of an M1 is better protected than the UFP of a 2A4.
The LFP and UFP of a 2A4 together also make up significantly more frontal area than the LFP of an M1.

@rainy2000

But why would you shoot the LFP […] unvarying turret ring though?

You should.
It’s just a MUCH smaller target than the 2A4’s entire hull, and aiming anywhere on the left (facing you) will guarantee a OHK.
Meanwhile, the M1’s turret ring tends to cause volumetric BS whereas the UFP or LFP of a 2A4 will not.