Why is Germany forced to suffer with Horrible 20mms even though by math they should be the best ones bug reports spanning multiple years and nothing been done. basically, every German prop uses this 20mm cannon and its horrible despite having better explosive mass then any other 20mm at a similar rank hispanos are lower shvaks are lower yet all of them do more damage .
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Cause they feel MG151s don’t need to be RealShatter for some reason.
If I remember correctly, MG151s are the only non-RealShatter cannons left.
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yea despite there airframes being one trick ponys which rely on good guns which they dont have
if they dont give them real shatter remove it from everyone else
Specifically it’s minengenshoß shells do not, all other shells on it have it, iirc gaijin said that realshatter wouldn’t make significant difference on them due to mine shells not relying on shrapnel to do damage.
You do realize realshatter makes the guns worse, no? It makes fragmentation a lot more random and inconsistent. It’s not nearly as bad as it used to be, but it’s still generally accepted to be worse.
And no, it should not “be the best because it has the highest explosive mass”, that’s entirely forgetting the role fragmentation plays in shells. Minengenshoß are extremely thin walled shells, they have almost no fragmentation damage. They (at a 20mm scale), do a good bit of damage to relatively soft targets over a medium area, but aren’t particularly damaging to structural members or over a larger area, this is accurate to their IRL performance.
Minengenshoß were meta in game for like, multiple years, they more or less 1-tapped everything, and honestly it warped people’s perception of what they should be. As they are now is a lot closer to how they should be then how they were. Atleast for 20mm ones, 30mm ones are still lacking a bit though.
shrapnel doesnt do anything if it did type 5 30mms wouldnt do same damage as a hispano you can check the damage model
Yeah, shrapnel doesn’t do as much as it should, it’s still why more explosive mass doesn’t just automatically make shells better. If anything other 20mms like the Colts that rely on fragmentation are underperforming more then the Mg151 is.
And it’s why stuff like a 20mm FI-T shell do more damage to a particular component then a pure HE one, the fragmentation largely hits the component that the shell impacts, dealing most the damage to it, which is more or less accurate to them dealing more structural damage then a mineshell.
RealShatter increased fragment count and simulates fragments better than the old system.
Look at literally any comparison of before and after it’s changes, it made almost every gun worse. Yes, I know it’s somewhat more accurate in some ways, but even with the increased fragmentation amount, it’s quite simply well below what would be IRL accurate, it’s simply not feasible to simulate that many. And that decreased quantity hampers it’s consistency to a point where it’s in some ways less accurate then before, as before had some baked in consistency.
Those comparison videos were prior to the bug fix where fragments would start inside the armor itself instead of inside the compartments.
The comparison videos for planes? planes don’t usually have armor. As I said, yes, they were buffed after it’s initial implementation, some even to be stronger then before, but as a net across all weapons it honestly made more worse then not. And for a mineshell with very low fragmentation anyways, it would just make it much less consistent.
You do realize you’re using ancient ass wrong data right? Realshatter’s bugs were fixed a long time ago. It is not a nerf anymore and is effectively a MASSIVE buff and is the ONLY reason the shvak/hispano etc do well now.
None of the MG151/20 rounds use realshatter. If atleast the FI-T one used it we’d be using Tracers n tapping ppl out of the air similarly to ShVAK’s or at the very least the Jap 12.7mms.
Realshatter causes significant difference atleast for prop tiers when it comes to damage when compared to hitpower (MG151).
That’s cuz rounds that use it will deal higher damage to the structure it hits while having a smaller spread of fragments.
While the Mineshell has a higher spread but will do less damage to the structure it hits.
That combined with the horrible ballistics n past nerfs leaves it behind of every other 20mm.
Mineshell
Type 99 Mk1 HEF
30mm Type 5 HEF-T
Realshatter still needs a lot of tweaking. Mainly when it comes to the number of fragments created n the spread. TNT equivalent doesn’t mean much for guns that use it also.
Higher caliber weapons (23mm n higher) that use realshatter aren’t very good cuz their final damage is roughly the same as a 20mm. Since It uses the same frag count pretty much. (More of an issue for jet tiers)
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