Why can't NATO have a well armored MBT?

Game Discussion General Discussion
#284

T-90M and T-90M Obr. 2020 are already in the game files. T-80BVM Obr. 2019 is basically just a BVR with T-90M sideskirts and the up armor option to also retain the Relikt add-on ERA. So the T-80BVM Obr. 2019 is basically confirmed too. So again, you’re wrong.

Wrong. I could send you videos and images of the new production T-90M’s or the refurbed T-72B’s, and you still wouldn’t see the truth. When the Omsk plant publishes footage of it’s first new production T-80’s I’m going to tag you just to make a point.

Also wrong

Again, wrong. But mostly because they aren’t drawing stuff up on napkins, they’re actual blueprints.

They haven’t ordered production on it yet. It’s still undergoing trials. The basic problem is the weight of the 57mm shell, and how to better design the drum, as well as some sort of drone carrying complex, which is easily more important on the battlefield than the 57mm at this point. They can produce a 2S38, it just doesn’t meet Russian standards, which do exist, and produce excellent combat vehicles at maximum efficiency.

If we took what you said without any doubt what-so-ever, we’d come to the conclusion that Russia no longer functions as a state at all, and that every factory is a burnt-out hole in the ground, and that there isn’t a single import to sustain what you’d claim Russia can’t produce domestically in the first place. You really should step outside the media-world you live in, and look at the experiences of people living in Russia, it’s not some dysfunctional hell-hole like you claim.

#285

russia makes a lot of claims. They also claimed to have sent an a working T-14 Armata into Ukraine but it was under special protection and no one saw it. But they said so… so it must be true…

Realistically they ain’t producing anything. They are struggling and keep up and just keep operational.

#286

I guess we can continue to put up with this fantasy russian nonsense, but in reality. Those aren’t going to happen. They are all lies and fake.

Show them to me deployed and not more fake images. The kremlin already got caught using war thunder images for their promo images and propaganda.

I don’t believe it, but if they bring them to the game we can be certain they will have more fictional characteristics and over performing armor and ERA.

But in reality, those tanks are pipe dreams filled with lies and propaganda. They shouldn’t be in game until we find another one dead and can confirm they have the claimed technology and armor specs. Which shouldn’t take long if they actually deploy one of these made up machines.

I saw another 2 dozen reports this morning. I am very correct in that they are struggling to keep what they have functional and that the in game vehicles are far far unrealistic compared to what they actually have.

#287

… Except… No. It wasnt a claim.

And again… No. New versions of T-90M, 72B3 and 80BVM are produced. New batches goes from manufacture every couple of months. It always supplied with footage.

#288

It was a claim, that they couldn’t back up. Fake. Like most of what they claimed about their tanks. Which is why their in game representation is atrocious.

#289

Fake what? New batches of equipment?

No, it wasnt.

#290

No, it wasnt, lol.

#291

Yes it was, and simple google search will bring it up.

Fake equipment. We have first hand reports they can’t fix what they have now, and some of the vehicles that have gone down cannot be replaced due to sanctions. We know this first hand. They cannot produce the needed electronics to build new or repair the vehicles they have now. Fighter jets and helicopters have resorted to having to use off the shelf GPS units at this point…

So no, the vehicles are all fluff, and hopefully they don’t get over the top dumb like the T-80BVM science fiction we have in game now.

#292

Show me a non kremlin, non russian source of the video and images. A 3rd party that can be trusted. If it comes out of russia you know its 100% lies.

#293

No, it will not.

Ah, fake…

Mm, first hand reports. Damn, i guess you are some CIA operative then. Wow.

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#294

SOOOO, what 3rd party can be trusted then?
P.S. And i fucking laughin from that last statement.
"A Russian and an American get on a plane in Moscow and get to talking.
The Russian says he works for the Kremlin and he’s on his way to go learn American propaganda techniques.

“What American propaganda techniques?” asks the American.

“Exactly,” the Russian replies."

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#295

Where do you get those first hand reports from?

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#296

There’s at least 400 T-90M’s active in service in the Donbass alone. You can watch the video where they left Uralvagonzavod with all the T-90M Obr. 2022 accoutrement, and the second batch months later with the Obr. 2023 instead, and the subsequent videos where they were handed over to Akhmat forces the first time, DPR militia the second time, and in a depot deep in Luhansk where Shoigu visited only 5 months ago.

No lies, not fake.

Prepare yourself too, because the T-90M and the T-90M Obr. 2020 are both in the game files, they are coming, no matter how much you whine.

When you start posting sources, I will. You have yet to post a single source across all our interactions in the last two weeks. It’s on telegram across different sources.

Lol, for what? I’d ask for a source but we both know you won’t provided it either.

Truth is stranger than fiction. Russia is a capable nation in real life, and an adversary worthy of your respect. Relikt is basically the best ERA in the world, much to your chagrin.

I saw another 2 dozen reports this morning. I am very correct in that they have produced far and beyond Western expectations and that the in game vehicles are far far underperforming based on what Russia currently has in inventory and in the field of battle.

See how that works? No one produces 24 individual intelligence reports all about different aspects of Russian industrial output and production on a daily basis. Unless you’re saying you have access to the CIA, DIA, MI5, MI6, Mossad, and Chinese intelligence agency’s daily briefings at your hand. If you did, you’d be wasting your time arguing with any of us here on a War Thunder forum thread when you obviously would have the kind of clearance that would make you a key member of your respective government.

Again, you can’t even admit that the majority of both tanks are being destroyed on the battlefield by ATGM’s and mines, and that neither Western or Russian designs have proven to be 100% immune to them. A Russian tank blowing up on the battlefield doesn’t make it fake. A Russian tank getting hit by an ATGM doesn’t some how invalidate how your tank of preference can’t destroy a specific Russian tank and it’s armor layout. Claiming Russian bias at every single thing you can is lazy. Be better bro.

#297

They used a still from a War Thunder trailer and made a poster out of it. We don’t even know how much that has circulated, and your complaint regarding this is??? The US Army has an eSports recruitment wing, should we complain that all the games they play are biased? You aren’t even proving anything with this point.

It’s not fake equipment. It’s real. And we don’t have first hand reports that say that.

There are limited aspects to which this is true. Some advanced components are harder or impossible to receive. That doesn’t mean they aren’t being produced. Elvira Nabiullina and her ministry did an excellent job from 2014 to the present day to make the Russian economy sanction proof. This is why, as the US and Western governments have admitted that the plan to destroy Russia with sanctions has not worked, and will not work. At this point we’re all paying more for gas and electricity because our governments have decided to do stupid stuff like sanctions and price caps which DON’T WORK. This is besides the point. The Russian government prepared for things like electronics to be the first things to go. For example, the Thales Group and their thermal imagers and targeting pods. Those are gone. But the electronics to produce similar products are not. Now that China is ramping up production of chips for these applications, Russia shouldn’t have any major supply issue.

The biggest example where Russia suffers is that they had to put a version of Sosna-U onto the refurbished T-72B’s they fixed up about a year ago instead of the newer nicer thermal imagers found on the T-90M and T-14. That there is the problem. Lack of components, which is entirely electronic, is not preventing the Russians from refurbishing their MBT’s and subsituting components. This in itself is barely a problem as tanks at this point are almost exclusively being used for fire support, far from the front lines.

They have even repaired damaged Ukranian T-64’s, 64BM’s, and BTR-4’s and put them into service with the DPR militia units. They can certainly repair their more recently designed domestic units that have active factories producing new units daily, let alone procure/produce parts for tanks that either aren’t produced in Russia, or haven’t been produced in Russia for over 40 years.

Always have. GLONASS and GPS did not exist when most of these vehicles were produced, and it’s easier to buy a $100 Garmin unit and sticky it to your cockpit. It’s about as absurd as Ukrainians using iPads to fire HARM AGM-88’s from their juryrigged MiG-29 pylons. Adapt, Improvise, Overcome… Right, Marine?

Just down right wrong again.

If a Telegram channel with video of what we claim were to appear here, you would probably call it AI, even though it would be too difficult to replicate with AI. I’m not sure it’s worth wasting our time.

Took the words right out of my proverbial mouth lmao.

#298

I just love wohoho Russian bias are not exist people and what make it funny is most people that keep saying that have less hours playing Russians top tier than me (even that i still found out bias on it are total BS) or just play single nation hell i’m sure they really don’t even know what they’re talking about.

#299

And?

#300

No experience = no value simple as that
How you guys think your opinion have value when you don’t even try it from tin air?
Seriously you just an ignorant

#301

I can understand why i need to play something to know it problems (like, how actually hard to play with poor traverse or gun depression). I dont understand why i need experience to say that something is not broken, when discussion is about its withstanding of enemy shots. Im playing against them? Yes. And thats enough.

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#302

He has no argument left, he’s onto the anecdotal side of things now.

His appeals are worthless if they only come down to I’ve played more games than you.

#303

In fact, the current purpose of the Russian Federation is twofold: to ensure the strongest position of the Russian Federation and to sell Swedish tanks, as well as later Hungarian tanks, while maintaining its unique features. It can be foreseen that in the future, the Leopard 2 in Germany will still be the lowest configuration. There are too many German players, and if the launched vehicles are too strong, no one will play with those unpopular trees