Well on the US part having enough especially top tier level, with all these underperforming Abrams tanks and one hstvl , I mean that is not enough equipment to properly compete with the German Leo series or Soviet lineups. Look at Adats cant compare it to pantsir when it comes to aa duties. Abrams vs Leo and T-series not really a comparison.
Plus look at it from the fun perspective, if one nation gets Frankenstein i think they should add it to others. (Not all the same) As for the burnt out equipment, captured and what not that’s real life. I am referring to gaming aspect of it.
Otherwise the vehicle set up created and the proposed tech tree, looks fun to me, so you will get a t-90, t-80 oplot plus 2a6 and pantsir, what about su25 will it gets some western long range missiles like the sm3.
Its fun to play but I think its op.
Su-24 got Storm Shadow, but this is a cruise missile that not really has any place in this game. I am still waiting for Su-25M1 or M1K with some missile like Maverick or similar
Only because they are literally have no DU armour and even a little bit similar armour composition to the real Abrams. Only realistic armour composition i’ve seen in this game so far is T-72B/90A/90M turret armour package
1 Like
How do you know this info, so the turret of 90m is true that it has more than 850mm of armor against kinetic rounds, including Oplot tank I assume? Did you actually see them? I have always taken info from thunder with a grain of salt.
I could see people complaining about this tree like they did China. A lot of the vehicles are just Russian vehicles with slightly different modifications done.
I also feel with the current climate it would bring a lot of hostility to the game which would not be favourable.
Maybe in the future, but I don’t feel like it belongs right now.
You can’t compare 1988 and 2010-2018 year systems, yes. now give USA and other countries some modern and comparable SPAA and see soviet mains cry like a little babies
I know armour composition of T-72 - T-90 tanks, and it is not really a secret information
In reality no, the armour composition is same from T-72B up to T-90M, amount of protection is fery different if you lok at different angle (not like in WT where we have the same efficiency on any angle) , also by currently known information, Relict ERA does not really work well against modern KE rounds, similar to Kontakt-5 which can only explode when hit with old and thick APFSDS(3BM22 for example)
It has different armour composition and looks like has thicker frontal armour on the turret, also ERA works against KE rounds, and it’s proven
Thank you for your feedback.
Finally people are saying constructive criticism and not just say “it’s clones, i say no”
1 Like
Well you mention Kontakt -5 exploding to 3bm version rounds only. I have read according to online sources that DM33 rounds and M829 A1 rounds were fired at it K-5. The US and German governments had access to T-80U tanks and , those rounds did not pen the 80U at its most armored section that is of course at 2km 90 degree angel, that means that Kontakt 5 did indeed work, angel dependent. Otherwise the US would not then create A3 rounds since it would not be necessary for them to do so if they were able to pen them with older rounds.
Yes of course online sources and drawings suggest 550mm base turret armor (cheek section) of T-72b tank. However the newer 90a turret cheeks section not the entire section of the turret of course increases to 700mm.
1 Like
What is then the armor values for Oplot tank and what is the ERA that it uses, so lets say I am in an M1a2 version tank fire A2 round distcance around 1km similar height no height advantage on my part, flat shot will it pen?
I agree with that one as well, too much drama. But we can continue the conversation of armor value penetration and the addition of new nations.
Nizh-1M offers about a 10-20% increase over K-5. Duplet-2M takes Nizh-1M and stacks them on one another, angled. Duplet-2M is the ERA used on the BM Oplot. The T-84U/BM Oplot zr. 2000 uses Nizh-1M only.
Even if it penned or not, the US still continued to develop the M829 round to maximize its effectiveness. Any country does this, regardless if the original worked, they’re still going to keep developing the munition to maximize its performance and remove any chance or risk of failure.
1 Like
I haven’t said that. My direct quote about this : “when hit with old and thick APFSDS”
I will elaborate further when i get back home
No dude no problem this not about accusations , its about me getting a compete understanding of armor values, cause I have been reading quite a bit online ever since playing this game. I find it interesting when there are discussions about armor and constitutes a penn vs non pen.
1 Like
This means that if Duplet ERA is added to the game then even DM63 should not be able to pen it frontally. What is then the theoretical overall protection added to the upper glacias of Oplot and Turret cheecks, hardest areas of the tank.
I get it and I haven’t thought that your message was an accusation. I just corrected you since you misunderstood me a little bit
All right good conversation, well take care. I am off to do a lot of University work. Thunder time is now over.
Okay. When i would get home I’ll make a big post about things you have asked, since there is a lot to explain
Publicly available information from Swedish MBT trials
Literally the best tank of USSR when it comes to armour.
Spoiler
The armor of the T-80U was estimated at 670 mm in rolled homogeneous steel equivalent. As can be seen from the scheme
value around 700 mm of protection in the T-80U turret is less than 40% of the frontal projection of the turret, the main value is within 460 mm, taking into account that most of the frontal projection (at 0 deg) in zone near the gun is not covered by the armor composition.
They are very impressive. This is comparison of BM Oplot-T with VT-4.
I believe that basic turret protection against KE rounds is 780-800mm of RHA equivalent.
Duplet ERA
If you hit the area covered in ERA - no, if you hit area that is not covered (it is small but chances still exist) it is likely to penetrate the armour
If these measurements are correct then definitely no if you hit the ERA covered place
|120mm M256: [M829A1 APFSDS-T]700
|120mm M256: [M829A2 APFSDS-T]750
|120mm M256: [M829A3 APFSDS-T]840
Fun thing about Relict and Kontakt-5 ERA
In fact, the Relict is the K-5, in which the breezability and sensitivity were slightly increased, which increased the chance of triggering on APFSDS. However, it has not been tested against thin western APFSDS as well as the K-5.
It is not clear why Relict became “so much more effective” than the K-5, except for dry text from the Research Institute of Steel I have not seen any proofs of this claims, not even photos from firings.
IRL Relict doesn’t show very good results. It works against non-tandem HEAT rounds as any other ERA does, but it has bad things like exploding all sockets for ERA if one socket is hit, same goes for Kontakt-5
Spoiler
