Correct me if I am wrong, but besides the BOL pods is this Tornado also able to carry AIM-9M’s?
And they can drag their feet for months and months on adding even basic weapons already modeled in game and would have no balancing issue
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Italian air force does not have 9M, it has essentially the same thing with the 9L/i-1. Additionally I don’t know if Italy ever ordered BOL pods from Saab. On the A200C the boz102ec fills this and additionally has maw. The boz product is also from Saab so if BOL pods were bought they would have likely been bought with the boz upgrades in bulk, which they were not
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But definetly worth debating whether its better to keep it at 11.7 with 9Ls or risk moving it up with Aim-9Li-1 (and its gaijin, so it more than likely would)
Would give the Tornado better self-defence in GRB, but in ARB and especially ASB, im always of the opinion that a lower BR is more valuable than a better AAM.
(of course if the EC-BOZ pods for some stupid reason increase the BR (it should not) then Aim-9Li-1s become non-optional)
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There’s an article on the subject from a reliable source—one of the most reputable websites in the field of military aviation
Additionally, please find a link to a public document confirming that the acquisition is made directly from SAAB. It’s a bit difficult to navigate, but it can be inferred that in 2015 a support contract was signed with SAAB for assistance with the BOZ-102 EC
chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://www.aeronautica.difesa.it/wp-content/uploads/2022/10/file4_2018_2019.pdf
I have no clue why the tornado is 11.7 with only two 9Ls in the first place, so many other planes get 9Ls and have better maneuverability at lower br. I think they should move A200A to 11.0, A200 1995 to 11.3, and keep A200C at 11.7 with maw pods and 9L
I dont know if there is any justifcation for moving the A200 down to 11.0 at this time for now. (though the F-5A(G) could certainly be used to argue that) but the Tornados do have a fairly decent defensive kit.
A200A, GR1 and ASSTA1 have 0 justfication for being 11.7 though and should be alongside the MFG, WTD61 and A200 at 11.3. These 6 airframes are essentially identical for ARB/ASB (Heck GR1 still has the nerfed engines for “reasons” and is the weakest of them all)
A200C just about gets what Id consider “justifcation” for being a slightly higher BR with MAWS and maybe extra flares? and probably could just about warrant being 11.7, just.
From the original contract, could not find a primary document but just this article
Tomorrow is air force day, they better add the maw pods
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I’d argue that the Tornado IDS should all get 9Li/Ms and remain at 11.7. If the Indian Jaguar can have two Magics at 11.3, why can’t the poorly implemented Tornadoes not have 9Ms at 11.7?
Yeah, its… possible, but tricky. I’d actually say the closest equivalents to the Tornados could be found with the Mirage F1C and Mirage 2KD at 12.0/12.3 respectively. With the Jaguar being massively over BRed to accomodate the Magic IIs.
So… Its hard to place the Tornado IDSs at 11.7 with IRCCM and impossible to justify them being at that BR without something extra.
Both Mirages are far superior in speed, maneuverability and even (high speed) acceleration though. The speed thing is what greatly annoys me the most in any case.
Perhaps, I think i’d still prefer to see the Tornado Gr1 drop down to 11.3 than recieve Aim-9Ms and risk moving up to 12.0 (which it 100% would because of Britain Tax).
With the extra flares and MAWS that the A200C should get. Then that alone could be enough to keep it going quite happily at 11.7 and then another push to get the Tornados finished. Things like radar, combat thrust, ECM, etc.
That could certainly be another way. And what about Combat Thrust? Is it something like what the MiG-21Bis used to have?
Mig-21BIS still has it as far as I am aware.
I think the best proposal I’ve seen for its implementaion is that it would be a limited use. About 5% more thrust I think for about 5 minutes. But this could be overtuned slightly to compensate for the fact we have too much drag currently.
Honestly I agree, A10C gets 4 9M, SM3 gets 2 R73 + 4 X38 which can be used in air to air. Right now I believe that the A200C is a heavier than the 1995, and just testing its a real bus. So are all the other tornados, who honestly could get killed by an A10C or SM3 in a dog fight (would get destroyed by Jaguar IS which in my opinion is a great dogfighter). At the same time they are all the same BR with heavily different weapons.
I would say that either buff all tornado’s flight stats and keep them the same, or keep them as they are and give them IRCCM, and its only 2 missiles which isnt that bad. Or just move it down in br. Gaijin could take advantage of their seperate air/ground br system (I have no clue why ground armament even has a consideration in air br anymore because of this), and move all tornados down in br and then just keep them at 11.7 in ground. Lastly GR.4 100% should go down to at least 12.0, if not 11.7 and move GR.1 under the f111c because gr.1 right now sucks
Eh… comparing a supersonic aircraft with sub-sonics in terms of loadouts is a bad way to argue for AAM buffs.
Otherwise I could argue the Jaguar GR1A at 10.7 should have 9Ls because the AMX at 10.7 has 9Ls and it just becomes a mess.
Better argument could be that the Tornados at 11.7 need a reason to be at 11.7 compared to their 11.3 counter parts and other interdictors like the F-111 at 11.7 have 6x Aim-9Ls and are much faster. touch on examples of the Jaguar IS (which is messy) but technically a supersonic with IRCCM at a lower BR and the Mirages just above also with IRCCM but other advantages like being faster and in the Mirage F1Cs case, also having SARH and you might just be able to argue for it.
Though given we cant even succeed in getting them dropped down to 11.3. I have little hope for that arguement ever working
12.0, maybe, 600 flares + 600 chaff does mean it survive quite well at 12.3. But 11.7 would be too low for it unfortuantely.
That I agree with, why they still refuse to give it the Mk103 engine is just crazy
I think not giving all Tornadoes their appropriate topspeed down low is even crazier. Would also somewhat negate the Gr.1s Mk 101s
The problem with the FM. Its only half fixed, with too much drag negating the aircrafts top speed. But Gaijin have said they wont do any more work on it. Meaning we have a half finished, rather bodged FM for the forseeable future