There is an extremely problematic artificial nerf for the AIM-7F on the F-4S

I’m using it in test flights against the enemy AI MiG-15s, and they are extremely inconsistant. The thing that absolutely holds them back is the unneccesary self destruct mechanic where the game just decides for you “Yeah, that’s not going to hit” within 3 seconds, when I can easily calculate in my mind that it’s absolutely going to hit that MiG 6 miles away, flying straight away from me at about 500 mph max, when I’m flying at mach 1.4 and the missile has about a minute of burn time with a max speed of mach 4.0. And in contrast, if the MiG is flying towards me, the missile will gladly fire from approximately 20 miles away and hit like it’s no problem.

The game needs to stop artificially self destructing my missile, after 3 damn seconds, because I fired the missile, the player. I think it’s going to hit. I do not need the games input on if they think the extremely botched calculations determine that it won’t hit, blow it up after the missile flight time is up. And the worst part of it is, the radar calculator in the game tells me a target is well within firing range, while the missile lock indicator disagrees. There’s 0 consistency between them, while all other radar guided missiles besides the Sparrow are consistent with what the range indicator tells you at least. Gaijin needs to fix this desperately because if this is how it works in game, and I’m betting it is, it’s literally game breaking. If a target is flying 500mph perpendicular to me when I’m going over mach, it will wait until i’m within 3 miles to fire a missile that claims a launch range of 62 miles.

This is very clearly effectively cutting the real life efficacy of the AIM-7F into a fifth of its real performance in the game. These missiles self destruct if they lose lock of a target, after a certain time after they run out of thrust, or if they get to their target, but don’t directly hit it, with proximity. Never to tell you that the computer doesn’t think you’re going to hit it, because computers can bug, just like in the game. Please fix this immediately.

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F4S + 7F is a good radar missile combo.

What aspect are you firing at? (their head, side, or tail?)

What range?

Ah I see, if they’re perpendicular to you they’re notching the missile seeker. Pulse Doppler can’t see targets moving sideways but is immune to chaff. Try shooting head on or no more than 45 degrees from their nose

Bro you have it all wrong.
In WT, none of the Aim 7’s have IOG (inertial guidance) and SARH missiles always work bad in rear aspect. notching hppens in side aspect. front aspect is where SARH and ARH shine best. its not a nerf for the Aim 7. its a universal SARH feature.

What altitude are you firing at? Mach 4.0 and long ranges are only capable at very high altitudes. The AIM-7F does not have a “minute of burn time”. It has a large force boost for 4.5 seconds + lower force boost for 11 seconds. If your target is 6 miles away and moving away from you, depending on the altitude shot then it is probably gonna lose energy before it gets there.

I have no idea what you mean by “radar calculator”. Please post a video of you using the AIM-7F so we can see where things are going wrong.

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Missile range indicator on the right hand side of your radar scope when you lock a target (the 3 moving bars)

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So you’re launching it cold and expecting it to hit? Do you know how radar missiles work?

PDV/PD radars are easily notched, so flying perpendicular to it you won’t get a good lock, firing from dead astern is a “cold” lock and won’t work unless you are super close.

I don’t know what you’re on about with the “The computer doesn’t think it will hit so it blows the missile up”.

That’s some interesting pills you’ve been taking buddy.

To sum it all up, skill issue, you don’t know how to use radar missiles lol

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The game isn’t self destructing the missile because it thinks it won’t hit. It’s self-destruction the missile because it has lost radar lock on the target.

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No, you don’t get it. The little circle that turns red when you can fire the missile, yeah? My radar locks on to the enemy just fine. However, I can fire at an enemy flying straight towards me 20 miles away, but I can’t fire a missile flying straight away from me until i’m about 5 miles away. There is no difference of radar locatability, because the target is simply straight ahead. The only difference is the direction of the plane, which is pure ballistics, not radar lock.

You’re absolutely right I wouldn’t get a good lock if I used PDV/PD mode. However, there is no issue with the lock. The lock is very good and consistent on the planes end, because I’m using SRC mode, not PDV. See, the F-4S is basically a modified F-4J with better performance and engines. The F-4J was fitted with a Pulse Doppler Radar (AN/APG-59) IN CONJUNCTION with the Look-down Shoot-down Radar (AN/AWG-10). I can understand your confusion because the wiki marks it as a “PDV-Radar” on the wiki, but don’t be fooled, it’s not only PDV, its also a very capable LD-SD, and as long as the PLANE has a decent lock, the missile should have no problem following said target, considering it easily will fire at a MiG-15 20+ miles away if it is flying towards my plane when I fire.

My altitude was about 25k feet, going Mach 1.4 already, firing at a target about 10 miles away at an altitude of 13k feet, so my missile should have an extra gravity boost along with the speed I’m already going. You are right though, I misspoke when I said burn time.

But then WHY do they work bad in the rear aspect? They seem to do just fine for every other SARH missile besides the Sparrow that I have tested, despite the fact that a SARH missiles performance largely depends on its host radar, which is very good in the case of the F-4S.

There is nothing wrong with my radar lock though, and the 7F is SARH, which utilize continuous wave, not pulse doppler, and I’m using SRC myself, so there should be no pulse doppler effect involved.

Lead your missile, have a solid lock.
This isn’t a nerf because that’d require it to not have existed prior.
Also rear-aspect shots are iffy for all radar missiles. Probably a game limitation.

I do lead my missile, I’m a crackshot SPAA and 0.0 delay bomber, I know how to lead and pretty well at that, but they simply won’t.

Also rear-aspect shots are iffy for all radar missiles. Probably a game limitation.

Perhaps, I can see that, but none are as heinously done as the Sparrow in all my testing.

I’ve extensively played with every single radar missile in Air RB. I do not think this is true at all about the 7F but I went ahead and put the F-4S the test flight to see if I could repeat your findings. I shot 12 and hit 12. All from either rear aspect or weird angles. I literally could not make the missile fail to track. I ask for a video of you using it because the behavior you’re describing is unusual

It would make sense if the target was chaffing but the MiG-15 AI should be no issue. Sometimes I’ve experienced various SARHs blow up when they probably should of tracked, but most of these were on highly maneuvering targets at low altitudes.

The missile itself sees in ‘pulse doppler’ so can be notched regardless of your radar’s tracking mode. This makes it almost immune to flares but notching and low speed differential targets (rear aspect) can confuse it.

Some SARH missiles use much older seekers that lack the much of the Doppler filtering so are easier to lock but highly vulnerable to countermeasures, and their carrier radars were lackluster at best so were generally pretty bad.

Sparrows don’t like rear aspect shots, but are happy with front and top aspect. Make sure the directional indicator when you lock the target is facing down to avoid the missile notching.

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You misunderstand. The tracking of the missile is fine, when it ALLOWS you to fire your missile, (aka when the lock circle turns red). The problem is getting to that point you have to get ridiculously close to the target before it lets you fire your missile without blowing it up 2 seconds after you fire it.

I’ve researched it, and from what I’ve found is that specifically the AIM-7F is CAPABLE of receiving pulse doppler information, but they primarily work by sensing a continuous wave, along with about every other SARH. The only sparrow that “sees in pulse doppler” is the AIM-7M. You make no sense to me at all. The aircraft radar is half of the equation, the missile seeker is the other. If the illuminator radar stays directly on target, and the missile can see what is illuminated, which it should be able to do within its tracking range, there should be no problem, only hampered by the missiles effective range.

Maybe I am misunderstanding the issue. I frequently fire with it just being gray with everything working fine. But just so we are the same page:

  • You are in the F-4S at 7600 meters closing in on a MiG-15 around 10km from you
  • You lock the target in rear-aspect with src mode
  • You turn on the AIM-7F which presents a gray circle lock. You fire and it blows up
    or
  • You wait for the AIM-7F to present a red circle lock after closing the distance considerably which tracks and kills the target

Do I have this correct?

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