The TY90's guide head should have image recognition, just like the 9M37M and 81C types

ODIN is just a CnP from the Wikipedia TY-90 page 2008-2013. There is a reason why developers do not acknowledge ODIN as a source.

ODIN:

Spoiler

TY-90 (Chinese: 天燕-90; pinyin: Tiān Yàn-90; literally: ‘Sky Swallow-90’) is the first air-to-air missile specifically developed for military helicopters in dogfights. Contrary to the erroneous claims, the missile is not developed from MANPAD missiles such as QW-1 Vanguard, but instead, it is designed as an air-to-air missile from the start. It is the world first air to air missile that is specifically designed for helicopters. Later, the surface-to-air version was further developed from the air-to-air version. Chinese determined that the MANPAD missiles converted for helicopter use in dogfights was not adequate, so a brand new air-to-air missile specifically for helicopter use was sanctioned, and TY-90 was the resulting product. The 3 kg warhead of the missile is specially designed to sever the rotary wing with a single shot, and the missile has all-aspect attack capability. The missile is designed to ensure a single shot would be sufficient to down an attack helicopter, or at least knock it out of action. At least three additional versions have been developed in addition to the basic version, and two of them being air-to-air versions. The first adopts a dual-band guidance, adding UV to the original IR, while the second adopts an ImIR guidance. During the 5th Zhuhai Airshow held at the end of 2004, a ground-launched air defense version appeared, with designation of DY-90, which was essentially the original TY-90, but with an additional option of incorporating a rocket booster to increase range upon customer’s request. A navalized surface-to-air version is also developed, utilizing the FLS-1 system and the basic version with IR guidance, thus providing a fire-and-forget capability in comparison to the case where QW-3 is used. However, this navalized version has not entered service as of 2008, and the reason is reportedly because that the Chinese military wants to wait until the more advanced dual-band or Imaging IR (ImIR) version to be incorporated into the FLS-1 system, which are currently under development. However, at Zhuhai Airshow, AVIC I, the developer of TY-90 only acknowledged the developing and active marketing such systems, but refused to further confirm whether the Chinese military or any foreign customers had placed any orders, and neither did the developer confirm such developmental works were privately funded by the developer or received any funds from the state or foreign customers. Despite marketing efforts, as of 2008, there is no known export of TY-90 of any kind.

Wikipedia:

Spoiler

Chinese discovered the MANPAD missile converted for helicopters in dogfights was not adequate, so a brand new air-to-air missile specifically for helicopter used was sanctioned, and TY-90 was the resulting product. The 3 kg warhead of the missile is specially designed to sever the rotary wing with a single shot, and the missile has all-aspect attack capability. The missile is designed to ensure a single shot would be sufficient to down an attack helicopter, or at least knock it out of action.

At least three additional verions have been developed in addition to the basic version, and two of them being air-to-air version. The first adopts a dual-band guidance, adding UV to the original IR, while the second adopts an ImIR guidance. During the 5th Zhuhai Airshow held at the end of 2004, a ground launched air defense version appeared, with designation of DY-90, which was essentially the original TY-90, but with an additional option of incorporating a rocket booster to increase range upon customer’s request.

A navalized surface-to-air version is also developed, utilizing the FLS-1 system and the basic version with IR guidance, thus providing a fire-and-forget capability in comparison to the case where QW-3 is used. However, this navalized version has not entered service as of 2008, and the reason is reportedly because that the Chinese military wants to wait until the more advanced dual-band or Imaging IR (ImIR) version to be incorporated into the FLS-1 system, which are currently under development. However, at Zhuhai Airshow, AVIC I, the developer of TY-90 only acknowledged the developing and active marketing such systems, but refused to further confirm whether the Chinese military or any foreign customers had placed any orders, and neither did the developer confirm such developmental works were privately funded by the developer or received any funds from the state or foreign customers.

Despite marketing efforts, as of 2008, there is no known export of TY-90 of any kind.

Also Jane’s? Jane’s is making so many mistakes about Eastern vehicles, developers will no longer accept Jane’s as a source. For example, 2019-2020 edition of Jane’s mentions that the Japanese Type 89 IFV does not have stabilizers.

And that ODIN is based on Wikipedia, not worth considering.

Previous reports have not provided any evidence that the TY-90 was mounted ImIR seeker, and there is currently no ImIR seeker in the game.

What we have in the game is a photocontrast seeker, which works on a different logic than ImIR.

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So how does this explain the ability of the TY90 to identify and attack enemy rotors in reality?

Look at the original text, that part only mentions that the warhead is effective against the rotor. Nowhere does it say that the seeker recognizes the rotor and attacks it.

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Thank you for the explanation of why ODIN is not a good source.

I have also noticed errors with Janes, particularly with the Chinese tanks, but beggers can’t be choosers if there is no information out there.

I did just find this book: https://www.books.com.tw/products/CN10141702. I’m looking into grabbing a copy of it, seems to have a good amount of information on Chinese missiles including the TY-90 being mentioned.


That said, not to derail the thread, but has anybody here had any experiences ordering from JingDong? I see they have some copies and offer international shipping, just don’t wanna get scammed trying to get a copy.

W020160520637682960316
Damn, this picture is too blurry
组图:国产PL-9C及天燕90空空导弹亮相_新浪军事_新浪网 (sina.com.cn)

You need your best friend:Z-lib

机载制导武器 | 金先仲, 《机载制导武器》编委会 | download on Z-Library
I find it,here you are.

1 Like

Wow! That’s great, saves me some money too and makes it easier to toss into a translator, thanks! I’ll start digging thru it in a little bit and post what I find.

Untranslated


ty-90-2
ty-90-3

Machine Translation


ty-90-2.translated
ty-90-3.translated

4 Likes

I’m not exactly too sure as to why the TY-90 would need another buff, relative to other helicopter-fired AAMs it’s already overperforming. The only part I can agree on is DIRCM (applies to most IR AAMs really), it shouldn’t really prevent you from locking the missile but rather attempt jamming the missile after launch. That and maybe increasing the heat signature of helicopters a notch.

Other AAM’s aren’t at the same tech level as the TY-90, an early 2000’s missile. The only thing that would be comparable to it would be is if the AH-1Z got the Aim-9X. The seeker is a 4 multielement seeker with a digital processor used to filter out IR-interference. DIRCM would not work on the missile since it is seeing 4 wavelengths in the IR spectrum, where DIRCM should blind 1 and be filtered out by the processor. As for helicopter lock-on range, it is unrealistic to think that the new anti-helicopter missile was designed to only be able to lock on ~2km. The missile is very sensitive, helicopters aren’t exactly IR stealthy either.

As to whether it NEEDS the buff or not, well did the Leo 2’s NEED their spall liners? No, they already were the best tanks in game. Furthermore, Chinese heli’s are over BR’d already because of these missiles. So I would at least expect them to work as they should and be able to kill a Ka-52, which still gets the luxury of slinging Vikhrs at anything even though the missile needed to be set before flight for air or ground targets…

2 Likes

Fair points, actually. It is pretty funny seeing the Chinese helicopters being heavily skewed towards AA duties just because of the TY-90s, while having underwhelming AG munitions in contrast. I also agree with adding the 9X to the AH-1Z, as it can only carry 2 of them unlike the maximum of 16 TY-90s on the Z-10. Adding the 114K to it would also be nice since it still uses the 114Bs for some reason.

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However, AH-1Z can suspend 12 114K while suspending 9M, while Z-10 can only suspend a maximum of 8 AKD-10

Moreover, the anti-interference ability of TY90 in the game has been weakened to a level similar to that of Stinger A

Never Gonna Give You Up (Anime Opening) (feat. Foxchase)-Thai McGrath.Foxchase

Because WT has the worst missile lock-on code, our dear programmer made the front-side infrared radiation of low-speed targets almost zero, which explains why it is currently difficult to lock onto helicopters except for missiles with image recognition

直升机锁不上?战雷红外强度探究_哔哩哔哩_bilibili

Honestly I wouldn’t mind having those 8 AKD-10s if they just weren’t so flipping slow. They have pretty good range, and a hefty amount of explosive mass. And 1400mm of pen certainly isn’t something to sneeze at. And you still have more AAMs than the 1Z on top of that, so I think it’s a tradeoff really (1Z with more AGMs but less AAMs, and the other way around for the Z-10)

It is quite infuriating having to get within 3-2km to get a lock with supposedly fancy-pants high-tech all-aspect anti-air missiles. At that range you might as well just use your AGMs instead. Stuff like the PARS 3 or Spike ER is actually more capable at anti-helicopter duties.

In fact, due to the fact that TY90 is mainly carried on Z19 and Z10, as well as the poor performance of the Chinese Doyle M1 and PGZ04A, TY90 has to take on most of the air defense tasks, if AKD10 can barely cope with Ka50, Ka52 (but AKD10 is too slow, and at the same time 9M127 also has a proximity fuse, and the flight speed is twice that of AKD10), then only AKD9 Z19 can only rely on its poor TY90, However, TY90’s poor infrared locking ability is doomed to fail in the competition with Ka50 and Ka52

To be fair you usually get teamed with Russia anyway, so that’s not as much as an issue. Still pretty annoying though. Honestly just increasing the heat signatures of helicopters in general is going to go a long way, although you still have to consider the way they modeled DIRCM systems on the 52 and 28NM… Right now it’s basically just a big “haha i’m immune to all IR missiles now” card.

1 Like