Just a curious question do tanks with the “152 mm Cannon” are they considered Tank Destroyers? Because the only tank I know with the 152 mm cannon is the Object 292 (Tank Destroyer), and the Object 120 (Tank Destroyer).
No, I don’t think that the 152 caliber constitutes it being a tank destroyer. I know the two you listed are at least 8.0 but there are tanks like the Kv-2 which are technically heavys…
Technically, the Object 292 can be classified as a tank destroyer due to it being an experimental vehicle with the 152mm mounted to a T-80 chassis to increase its effectiveness against Western MBTs. Though the underlying design is still that of a MBT.
The Object 120 is a purpose built tank destroyer which also coincidentally has a 152mm cannon.
However, you have vehicles like the SU-152 which was built as a mobile artillery piece/assault gun and not really meant for tank to tank combat, it just happened to be good in the role. Much like many 155mm artillery pieces in the game i.e. M109 can destroy tanks through sheer force (overpressure mechanic but whatever).
Depend where the vehicle was applied.
Using ISU-152 as example, in-game we know as Tank Destroyer but in reality, could be used as Tank Destroyer but at same time as Tank Buster.
Object 292 is part of a attempt of standardization of a higher caliber cannon, 152,4mm, with that, it’s a whole subject to talk. If we get exactly the vehicles designations, we’ll see KV-2 as Tank Destroyer basically, even having such well armored chassis.
No they aren’t considered TDs unless they were specifically design for that purpose. Especially when u look at the US gun launcher era with the M60A2, M551, MBT-70…
With the 140mm mbt trend we are seeing today, won’t be long till we see actual production 150mm mbt cannon.
TL;DR, it’s not that 152mm equipped tanks aren’t tank destroyers, it just that 152mm isn’t typically a calibre specialised for use in the anti tank role.
Tank destroyers have a lot of common characteristics, but I don’t believe there are any real rules about what features either qualify or disqualify a vehicle from being a Tank Destroyer.
Tanks with 152mm cannons would definitely be considered tank destroyers if that is what they were indeed designed for. Given that certain ammunition only exists to destroy tanks, you could reason that tanks like object 292 and obejct 120 have APFSDS rounds, and are therefor tank destroyers. I would also argue that the SU-152 and ISU-152 are tank destroyers for similar reasons; the BR-540B is an armour piercing round, as opposed to the G-530/G-530sh anti concrete rounds.
I agree and disagree with Jaded_Sakura77, I agree in that the SU-152 is an assault gun designed with demolition and artillery in mind as opposed to tank on tank combat. However, I don’t think being ‘bad’ at the tank destroyer role prevents a vehicle from being considered.
I don’t think we will see 150mm, maximum 130mm, 120 guns still haven’t used their potential, I’m not saying how fast a gun above 130mm wears out, and how little ammunition it has, these are things you can’t skip unless you change the laws of physics
I mean going above 120mm mean u would probly need an autoloader, bigger breach mean less space for the crew and lets not even talk about the economies of it.
Still would be pretty sick seeing 150mm+ cannon mbts in the future, maybe a hundred years from now and everything is unmanned. As for now the future would probly be 130-140mm tho.
Its not the now the countrys of the world use IFV och mbts look at the polish prototype tank that came out in the 2000s it had a 150 but was considerd an mbt
Well you have the US XM803 & MBT-70 as well as the German Kpz-70 which are all the epitome of an MBT and definitely not tank destroyers even though they all have a 152 mm cannon.
I aways wonder how a cannon like that would cost in real life
It’s all about what the vehicle was designed for.
Quite literally a tank destroyer is simply that, A vehicle made solely for destroying tanks as opposed to something like an infantry tank which is made to support infantrymen.
So a tank has numerous reasons for being many of which are not actually to engage other tanks where as the tank destroyer is made to destroy those tanks.
Its a doctrine that died out somewhat as the years progressed.