Is there any specific reason why the T20 (which has literally the same gun as the Hellcats and 76mm Shermans) doesn’t get APCR or smoke rounds, where the previously mentioned tanks do?
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APCR is useless anyway, so the only realistic thing you can ask for is smoke.
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A: APCR is not useless, large majority of players have been fed this idea from larger content creators and/or they think “APHE just means an easy kill so why bother with anything else,” more pen is never a bad thing. There are certain spots on tanks that APCR can pen on the 76mm where no other ammo type on the tank can (albeit from rather close range, 100m or less) . Granted these spots on certain tanks are few and far between, but I would rather have a few APCR on me just in case. Same argument for the 76mm HE, you almost will never use it, but you carry it for that one battle where you see an open top vehicle where AP of any kind wont do much damage to since it would just pass straight through.
B: Useless or not, why remove certain ammo types from the exact same gun in the first place? I’m sure they do this to other countries and vehicles, but my point still stands, as both Hellcats and the Easy 8 (at least) can all carry the same ammo types with the same gun, yet the T20 can’t? What’s the harm in adding the ammo it should and could use, especially if they’re on other tanks with the same gun?
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Or, you can just aim for a weak spot with APHE and kill the enemy.
Feel free to give me tanks where you need APRC and APHE will not be enough…
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All of these will be frontal pens just for reference.
Probably the most common one you’ll face at the 6.0 BR range, the Tiger 2 H: APCR can pen the gunner’s viewport. This is a much flatter surface to aim at compared to the MG port, which can be and usually is with 76mm any type of ammo, inconsistent. APCR on the gunner’s port (using the armor inspector) can be penned up to 400m away, knocks out both gunner and commander, if you’re lucky also has potential to detonate ammo.
The French and Italian M26s (and American if you get mixed battles): APCR can pen the big flat plate on the UFP and a higher change of going through the front/side of the turret where the ammo is kept at, from slight angles. Yes, you could aim for the MG port but again, big flat surface will be more consistent.
The French and if you get mixed battles, American Jumbos: APCR can go through the front of the gun mantlet, granted not 100% of the time in some spots, but APHE has 0 chance at all from any distance, APCR has quite a few spots to pen at least, out to at least 200m away. APCR can also go through the turret ring, whereas APHE is 50/50.
Tortoise: Yep, believe it or not, 76mm APCR can go through the gunner’s viewport. Has 100% of pen and takes out at least the gunner, with chance to spall into the commander, loader and machine gunner, where APHE is again only50/50. There is also the machine gunner port, but this won’t take out the gunner and still leaves a threat to you (APHE here is also a 50/50).
FV4202: In the chance you uptier it to 6.3, which I wouldn’t blame you, the T20 can still perform here even without APCR, APCR can must more easily pen the big turret ring and even the gun “mantlet” (yes I know it’s not a mantlet, but you know what I mean).
IS-3: I’ll admit, this one is a bit picky, but it’s possible to pen the IS-3 with APCR through the gunner’s view port, APHE can also do this, but APCR is better for this as it’s a sub caliber round. As with the FV4202, you’d need to uptier the 76mm to 7.3.
There’s also the M46’s, but for the most part they act the same as the M26 in terms of them being penetrated. There are probably more tanks with spots you can pen, I just don’t wanna look more than I did. Even if nobody actually aims in these spots, higher shell velocity isn’t a bad thing.
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Yeah, engaging a heavy tank a whole BR higher frontally with a medium tank without armor is a good idea…
You can just shoot the cuploa btw with APHE, and it will work much better.
What you described with the APCR is the ideal condition, which almost never occures.
Ooooor, you can just aim for the 2 sies of the lower plate to get a guaranteed ammo rack in the hull. If somehow the ammo does not explode, the APHE is still strong enough to kill all crew.
Even weaker APHE can pen those ports consistently, it just sounds like a ton of skill issue.
Side of the turret at some fairly large part is like 130mm effective, so just use APHE again.
Yeah, i bet volumetric and APCR are very compatible xd. The protection analysis is trash for these kinds of things btw.
Same lower plate weak sot and the turret front is also much weaker.
Hitting the MG port is a bad idea. The Tiger IIs have an aditional plate behind the MG port which will stop the round.
Besides that, it is very hard to hit such a shot on the gunner sight in an actual match, even from close range, due to a number of factors like tanks moving, turrets turning, and the fact that the 76 mm has pretty bad dispersion. You’re basically just as likely to hit the lower half of cupola with APHE, which will deal more damage to the turret crew, and you won’t need to switch rounds from APHE to APCR.
Nevertheless you shouldn’t be engaging Tiger II (H)s frontally with a mobile vehicle that is the T20. Use your mobility to get to their sides.
M93 can barely penetrate the flatter, thicker area. 162.5 mm CHA at an angle of 25º will provide 183.3 mm of effective thickness against APCR, so assuming the M26 is perfectly unangled, you’ll only be able to reliably penetrate up to about 150 meters. And that’s assuming completely unangled hull, if the angle of incidence is 27º, it will not pen.
When it comes to hitting the turret front on the spot you’ve mentioned, the difference is not noticeable. The only actual difference on the turret is on the mantlet, which APCR can pen and damage the breech.
The thinnest that the mantlet gets is 177.8 mm thick. As it is CHA, that means 167 mm RHA equivalent. Theoretically you can pen up to above 500 meters with M93, but that also relies heavily on dispersion making it so you actually hit the spots where it is thinnest, which are very small. Also the turret ring area is inconsistence even with APCR.
Still, the APHE can make more use of stuff like the MG port, and the cupola is also a weakspot on the Jumbos which APCR can’t really use but the APHE round can, while also dealing more dealing more damage.
Hitting the gunner sight with APCR has the possibility to only take out the loader and no other crew mates, so damage is highly inconsistent. Besides it has the same issue as the Tiger II (H) gunner sight, except it’s even smaller.
This is yet again a tank you shouldn’t really face frontally in the first place.
The turret ring is 200 mm thick CHA, meaning it is 188 mm RHAe, so unless point blank you won’t pen. Sure, you can try the turret front near the gun, but you can also just once again shoot the cupola with APHE without having to switch to another projectile.
That spot is so inconsistent even in protection analysis its barely even worth trying.
Noone is complaining about the fact that APCR is faster. The problem with this APCR round specifically is that the use case scenarios are so few and far between, and even the ones that do exist are limited themselves. It’s simply not really worth using this round.
Overall the T20 is fine as is right now. It is an extremely mobile tank with a low speed stabilizer, good reload and post penetration damage with APHE. Phenomenal flanker.
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Honestly, I don’t really care about getting APCR on the T20, since it is so rarely useful that I haven’t encountered a situation where I needed it. I rather have smoke shells and have it lowered to 5.7, which would be a much more balanced Battle Rating
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The only time I use 76mm APCR is against Tiger 1s at certain distances and angles when APC won’t be able to penetrate them.
Otherwise I can’t think of a single other case I would load APCR.
Smoke rounds would be very nice to have though.
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Now that they added apcr can they please add smoke shells.
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Seriously 😂😂