you have no sources, vs sources that have been put out and been out for years.
Ok, one of the officials stated the rcs of the f22 is like a marble, now comes the problem
- which marble?
marble comes in sizes of radius of 0.6 cm to 2.5cm, for which rcs is from 0.00011m2 to 0.0019m2
- what frequency?
RCS varies a lot with frequencies due to the nature of how these EM wave reflect from different sized objects, literally no value of the frequency was given in the statement
- what angle?
RCS varies a lot, even with a change of a degree in angle for stealth jet
so the “marble” figure, is it all aspect(this one is literally impossible btw)? or frontal average? or just some specific angles (highly likely)
a vague idea of the frontal aspect was given for f35 tho
So the “0.0001m2” rcs figure you have given us is like a pixel from a 4k picture, tells barely anything, if you do get rcs value (which are not sekrit documents) do mind us giving in THIS FORMAT BELOW WITH A FREQUENCY
(this is just for example)
and incase if you send us some simulations, do mind simulations give rcs value lower than IRL, however it would be helpfull if it is compared to some other jet like Su-57(which comes under this topic) under SIMILAR CONDITIONS.
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F-22
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F-35
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can you translate it for me? I don’t understand Russian, but I’m still interested
For F-22, the grid is 128921 fasts, in the first graph on the Y-axis, the RCS m^2 on the X-axis is the irradiation angle. Monostatic scattering
in the second graph is bistatic scattering
F-35 124584 grid
3 Ghz and 10 Ghz lines
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The POFACETS program gives accuracy depending on the number of cells in the grid. If you take a better grid, the results may vary. The objects are completely metallized
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Ausair powers POFACETS simulations of su-57 also had similar resualts
its not very detailed but its way more “detailed” than the f22 and f35 given in these simulations
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and what can be understood in this smear?
the legend below shows the Dbsm values for the colour
in the middle (at 180 degrees) is the nose section
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Does anyone know what how many arh missiles it can carry on outer pylons, if it gets any?
Su-57? 6 total. 2 per wing and 1 on engines… In bay’s with older missile 4 R-77-1 and 2 R-73’s “Types”. Its unknow how many can carry with “newer” missile. In the vid Lord of the sky. It was show that the Bays on the wing can carry 2 heat seeker per bay. But Idk if that was a mistake or if that what their aim for.
41:51
Spoiler
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it gets 4 underwing external pylons, and hardpoints under intakes to but i was only able to find images of them being carried by some TGP. It has 2 wing root triangular bays for 2 fox 2/ir missiles. and finnaly the main internal weapon bays. there are 2 of these with one of them carrying atleast 2 and allegedly 3 r77 variants with folded fins/planar fins. thing is that there is literally NO IMAGE of the main internal weapon bay other than this one
also this
the weapon with the number “180” is izdeliye 180, the r77m/e
the one with “170-1” is r77-1
the one with 760 is i believe a modern variant of r73
To add to this, I was looking for an old article when I stumbled accross a report from the CIA where they basically admit that the US does a load of propaganda to intentionally hide their RCS numbers from the public.
This is from 1988, two years before the ATF’s prototypes would fly. ATB would be the B-2 program, though, which was already flying.
At the end of the report, they give a list of info seen on the ‘common’ press through 1975-88:
We can also see that the range and speed ‘predictions’ were somewhat in line with the ATF requirements, and the RCS values there are much more in line with what we see in simulations for an overall average value (also kinda falls in line with Davidenko’s 0.3-0.4m2 average). 0.000001-5m2 on the B-2, though, lmao.
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too bad some f22 fanboys are gonna take it that f22 rcs is even smaller than 0.0001m2
good find tho
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where did you get this tho?
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I honestly feel like stealth in wt will only ever come into play at ranges exceeding 60km, maybe even 100.
Which is to say, with current weapons they wouldn’t play much differently than the average 120 slinger.
Once aim120d/meteor/r37/pl15 come into play stealth will be important, because engagement ranges become much bigger.
one thing that is often forgotten about stealth is the missile’s seeker.
That’s in part why there’s more and more missiles with AESA seeker around in the 2020s
Story is I was reading the book “Stealth” (1989) by Doug Richardson (very good book, I recommend checking it, the section on RAM/RAS is especially good).
There I read an indirect citation (p. 127) that said that, in the May 1986 edition of the “International Defense Review”, the USAF Aeronatuical System Division commander said the ATF would be “one or two orders of magnitude less detectable” than the F-15. So I went looking for the 1986 periodic, and that’s basically how I found the pdf: clicking stuff on search engines. I saved it just in case (it’s called “US Stealth Programs and Technologies: Soviet Exploitation on the Western Press”, dated 1st August 1988), it’s not secret anymore – it’s been “sanitized for release”, and I also found the 1986 periodic (at least I think I did, it might be Jane’s IDR, but there’s also Bill Sweetman’s IDR, which is what I’m looking at rn), though I have only skimmed it so far.
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