All new weapon systems are buggy as hell on addition. PGMs are borderline unusable currently.
And most of them have other options other than TV guided ordinances unlike the SU-39 no?
If an F-16 decided to sit on the ass of a Tornado, you’d be dead even quicker, with basically no CMs and no IRCM
Yeah but I gotta call cap, in the Tornado you must use speed as your advantage and in my F.3 there’s been many times where I simply out speed a MiG-29 or F-16A.
the IRCCM on it is totally broken and 9/10 times it will go for flares, even in a situation in which it, by all IRL data and historical records indicate, it should have ignored them.
You realise the AIM-9L doesn’t have true IRCCM? People just say it for simplicity but that’s what the AIM-9M is for (AIM-9L with a IRCCM upgrade).
It does have a longer range, I’ll grant you that, but maxes out at about 3-4km realistically speaking.
Telling me the R-60M has longer range than the AIM-9L is like telling a elderly man age doesn’t matter. Obviously without a doubt and practically everyone could agree the AIM-9L has longer range ma man.
10-15km range, a lot better IRCCM and much higher Gs
The R-73 would RARELY reach that range but more like 4.5km to 3km at low altitude, and the R-73 only can pull 40g (R-73E specifically).
4xR-60s (which I think is a missing loadout not a balancing issue)
Yeah I totally agree, we should’ve gotten it with the vehicle in the patch not separately.
the f3 is an upgraded tornado for intercepting purposes it got better engines and it is faster that you compare this to normals tornados shows you have no clue
you called it IRCCM and we just say it doesnt have any protection currently and gets flared easily
he talked about aim 9l having longer range read it right
yes that is true and the only agreeable upgrade the su 39 can get
Laser guided bombs (though they too were really buggy on addition and only got CCIP in the last update, making them far easier to use in ARB/GRB)
When the harrier Gr7 was added. AGM-65Ds were really hard to use and buggy as hell, and the Paveways never hit what you wanted to hit without diving bombing. So 99% of the time ,I just used dumb bombs for the first few months.
Now a lot of the issues with PGMs is because of issues with the TV sight on them, so a fix for them will fix the Su-39. Also Su-39 is probably deserving a targetting pod.
But no new jet is bug free, and often it can take months to fix. Harrier Gr7 still has a few missing loadout options like 540lb bombs on all but 2 pylons and placeholder targetting pod and AGMs. The Sea Harrier still has a placeholder radar and cockpit. Even the F3 has only just gotten rid of its placeholder radar.
Historical records indicate that if the target is on reheat. Flares should do very little, if anything, especially in rear aspect. Yeah, I know, but for the sake of ease, its quicker and easier.
Best ATGM In game? Yes but not the best missile overall anymore especially after the nerf.
the f3 is an upgraded tornado for intercepting purposes it got better engines and it is faster that you compare this to normals tornados shows you have no clue
You realise this applies to all Tornados unless they obviously bring full payload. At the end of the day they’re not going 2000km at the deck but 1300km which is achievable by all variants, and have you forgotten about the German or Italian IDS?
he talked about aim 9l having longer range read it right
Well his wording wasn’t the best but my point still stands even if I’ve misread it or not?
you called it IRCCM and we just say it doesnt have any protection currently and gets flared easily
I specifically said “IRCM” for a reason, I said it in a way to show that it’s somewhat questionable (which it is).
Laser guided bombs (though they too were really buggy on addition and only got CCIP in the last update, making them far easier to use in ARB/GRB)
Laser guided munitions are much more reliable and effect, and this is because they won’t be exploding mid air or losing track unlike the Kh-29T or KAB-500Kr.
When the harrier Gr7 was added. AGM-65Ds were really hard to use and buggy as hell, and the Paveways never hit what you wanted to hit without diving bombing. So 99% of the time ,I just used dumb bombs for the first few months.
The issue is that this was a past thing and War Thunder has gotten much quicker when is comes to patching these bugs. Most of the things like the Kh-29T aren’t “bugs” but just the goofy ah TV guidance.
Now a lot of the issues with PGMs is because of issues with the TV sight on them, so a fix for them will fix the Su-39. Also Su-39 is probably deserving a targetting pod.
Yeah I think the SU-39 should 100% get it’s IR targeting pod and with the addition of laser guided things as the TV guided munitions are extremely unreliable.
Historical records indicate that if the target is on reheat. Flares should do very little, if anything, especially in rear aspect. Yeah, I know, but for the sake of ease, its quicker and easier.
And historically the USSR had much better IR missiles so you’d have to get use to it for many months (especially when they add the R-73).
Only until the 9M, at which point, the russians never really caught back up again. For about 5-10 years before that, yeah, the R-73 was better. I seriously suspect that the next gen of aircraft added will have both Aim-9Ms and R-73s respectively. Just becasue IRL, there was a gap, doesnt mean gaijin will translate that gap in game (the AMRAAM was in service before the R-27ER I think, so…) Chronologically we are 1996 ish, Aim-9M was in service and widely deployed, even on the Tornado F3 during the 1991 gulf-war.
The only fair way to add the next gen of missiles, is to add them evenly to all. Unless you are saying that they should give the west amraam and not give the Soviets R-77 for a while
Yeees but the A-7s, especially the 7E, have been artificially nerfed because they were the best ( NOT OP though) thing at THAT time. Though you can’t say that about the A-7K, that thing is completely unhistorical armament wise and it and the 7E should swap places (even then, the 7E could do better)
Again, it’s not that they’re in a better spot, they just do not see top tier, the same will happen to the 25T/39(ew premium pooper, don’t talk to me lol) eventually.
F-16 and Mig-29 are going 1400-1590 km/h on the deck. They will catch every Tornado. And unfortnately also outspeed Tornados while going for bases.
When I try to play my own Tornado, its pretty much a lame duck. The bases are all snatched by F-16’s, by the time they bomb the bases, you already fell back like 10km …you have no chance to make your bomb drop.
Tornado at 11.3 and 11.0 are unplayable in a uptier. You won’t get a base, cause F-16 get them alot faster and ofc you get lol killed by everything with Aim-7F or R27ER. You can’t run, you can’t maneuver, you only have 2 AAMs which get spoofed by already one flare.
Its also the same fate for the Su-22 or any other Strike aircraft above 10.7. Unfortnately 11.0 is 12.0 in like 85% of all games. I wish there would be a mechanic to somehow reduce the number of uptiers. Whats the point of a BR like 11.0, when its in fact 12.0 all the time. WT is sometimes really lame.
Even in a downtier, my Tornado has a hard time to run from F-5E’s. 1250-1300 on the deck is just mediocore. Most jets easily get that. I’d choose a Su-25 or 35 every day. Cause advanced CAS ordnance beats speed, at least when its not enough speed to run from fighters anyways.
I mean when you got a Tornado IDS with max load obviously it would be slower, but something like a clean Tornado IDS (A2A missiles only) or a Tornado ADV attempts to outspeed a MiG-29 or F-16 it shouldn’t have any problems.
Only when running low on fuel, With the Tornados Fuel burn, you dont really want to be doing that for long. Though the F3 has got the much better engines, Tornado Gr1, with no bombs, half fuel, maybe 1.1 ish. Easily catchable by a Mig-29
The TV missle issue was so lame for a while, but not that it’s fixed you can get some long range yeets with both the Kh-29T and mavericks.
Also a thermal targeting pod called the Khod was found in the files for the Su-39, but since it hasn’t been added yet I’m woundering if the devs plan to release it later or something. Hard to say.
Same plane is literally on the tech tree, the radar is very clunky as well. If only the TWS mode was good, but it actually is a detriment cuz it randomly switches targets.
Ok. The big difference being that it actually needs to be grinded out, which tends to earn those kinds of people some actual respect lmfao.
And then the premium buyers cope that it sucks in ARB when they coulda just bought the MiG-23L (L for losers)
I have the entire soviet air tree yet i bought the su-39, so it is p2w? i just like higher rewards, but it just means i am not to be respected because i am using premium version?
It’s not p2w that’s for sure, but this entire thread is just made for someone to cope about their wet little dreams and becuz they don’t want to acknowledge they made a poor financial decision.