I guess I’ll submit the P.1000 Ratte then
What constitutes an (unfinished) prototype:
- Vehicle was (partially) constructed
- Vehicle-specific parts (i.e. guns, powerplants, etc.) were built
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So the Coelian is back on the menu?
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depends, was any of the parts built specifically for the Ratte?
everything I can see is that most of the components were taken from off the shelf designs for other vehicles, the Guns from the Scharnhorst class, the engine from U-Boats and there is no primary sources to even suggest that it made it past a drawing stage, let alone into the stage of an unfinished prototype
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Based on how i’m understanding it, probably not
I’m guessing the keyword here is “Vehicle-specific parts” since i don’t think a single part was created for the Coelian, it’s a no go
Hull of the Coelian obviously existed but thats a part meant for a different tank and was not specifically constructed for the Coelian and therefor might not be included
Menawhile the Hull for the KRV was specifically built to become a heavy tank
If they they allowed stuff that technically already had parts avaliable, than you’d get a lot of blueprint tanks that never even got past mockup
Take the Strv 2000 140/40 for example
Green is existing parts that they could just slap on
Blue is existing parts that would need too be modified
Red is none-existing parts that would have needed too be built
So the most important part here is red for it to be added for consideration but no amount of green and probably blue would let it be added
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The cannons and shells also existed tho? That’s already more than what the KRV has…
Blue is existing parts that would need too be modified
Can you show me a picture of the cannon or ammunition? (for the Strv 2000)
Can’t really find out what the cannon is from, I see some mentions of it being domestic, some that it might have been the german 140mm
There was a mention of the 140mm pros and cons
“25% to 50% better armor penetration (up to 800 mm/2ft7 of penetration) and twice the muzzle energy of the 120 mm cannon. However, it also came at a cost. First of all, the 140 mm rounds were very large, so fewer of them could be carried and an autoloader was essential.”
So unsure if this means they actually had a 140mm that they tested, got the results from somewhere else or possibly just did some math
i’ll look around for a bit and see if i can figure it out
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The Strv or the Coelian?
If we are talking Strv, even if the cannon did exist, it would have just been modified of an existing one and not considered vehicle-specific-part i’d think
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Ughhhh i soo want the strv 2000. WHYY DID WE RUN OUT OF MONEY
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The Coelian, it uses the same cannon as the Ostwind 2
As for the Strv (or KRV as I’m not sure which one we are talking about right now), the 140mm is definitely a vehicle specific part (and so is the 150mm for the Krv)
Besides costs, there was also the matter of time and possibly politics
First you might need a new factory (probably multiple) built which would take a while, after which you’d need to build the tanks themselves which would take even more time depending on how many we’d want
Obviously starting off with the prototype which would probably require a few redesigns as we went along and noticed something was bad or just not needed which would cost even more and require more time
And this is all while we are using older tanks that would eventually become obsolete against other tanks of the time so we’d be lagging behind other countries that might pose a threat to Sweden
So instead buying foreign design that was actually built and ready + good was just cheaper and faster
It also has the added benefit of possibly improving military cooperation between countries
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well the cannons would be classified as Green or maybe Blue in this case rather than Red so it’s not considered Vehicle-Specific-Part and was just a pre-existing AA
The Red part for the Coelian would be the turret itself without the cannons and as far as i’m aware it was just a mock-up with no piece of it being made
That being said, Ostwind 2 is kinda of a funky one itself as I can’t really find any blueprints of, not saying it didn’t exist but there’s a possiblity that the turret design in war thunder is wrong
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Since the hull for the KRV which is a Vehicle-Specific-Part (Red) was made, the turret and whatever was inside it (cannon + autoloader) gets and automatic pass even if they weren’t built
Since I can’t figure out who made the 140mm or if it was specifically made for the Strv 2000, can’t really say it’s a Red but the drawing indicated that was a pre-existing cannon and only needed to be modified
Edit:
Keep in mind that the Strv 140/40 was still in it’s design/planning stage and there was multiple ideas that could have been built instead so doubt anything for them was built at all
There was other ideas like the T120B which would have used a 120mm instead
O140/40 which is an unmanned turret version
L140 which was a 140mm mounted on the Cv90 hull
2nd Edit:
Found this
“According to some data, due to the lack of own developments in this area, the Swedish tank builders decided to resort to the help of German colleagues. At this time, Rheinmetall began work on the project NPNK-140 140-mm tank guns, designed to re-equip Leopard 2 MBT.”
So yeah it was just a foreign cannon and not specifically built for the Strv2000 + Rheinmetall didn’t want to share/sell the 140mm at the time since they were new and still being tested
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The biggest factor was cost. Time wasnt really the problem since they still had to functionally remake the leo to their own standards but the swedish army just didnt find it profitable to build their own vehicle when they could just buy one.
Which makes me annoyed since the strv 2000 would easily be the most capable tank on the market now if it was actually built.
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Absolutely a +1 from me! The thought of Sweden getting a unique heavy tank is awesome! Also as an afterthought, would be cool if you could switch between the different guns that was planned. I’d imagine it would be kinda like how you can switch up guns on some airplanes. It would give an increased flexibility to the tank, and players can change the gun to suit their playstyle.
Whoa the strv 2000 is crazy! 120mm or 140mm with a 40mm coaxial autocannon? gib me
Also the frontal hull armour composit would have equivalent 1.2m of chemical protection! iirc
Time was definitely a factor. After testing foreign tanks, primarily in the form of Leopard 2A4 and M1A1, it was realised that the performance of Swedish tanks was more behind the curve than was previously believed. As such, priority was placed on replacing older tanks as rapidly as possible. Further development of Strv 2000 was still considered, but the funds that would have been required to speed up development were not available. Cost was a factor yes, but only in relation to to the need to replace older tanks in a timely manner. Profitability however was never an issue, Strv 2000 was not made for export but specifically tailored to Swedish requirements
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It had assisted autoloader simillar to ARL-44.
Suggestion passed to the developers for consideration.
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