I did not know this, thanks for enlightening me :)
Not added on top of the 2A6M, but added on top of the base 2A6.
i’m comparing it to the foreign variant (the Canadian 2A6M) because that is what Germany used to upgrade further to 2A7. at least according to Wikipedia. and knowing Wiki they (and thus me) might be wrong.
i’m just writing out the information i’m reading.
(i actually think Wikipedia is interchangeably using 2A7 and 2A7V it seems like… i think you are correct here, the 2A7V is the tank i’m thinking of and are referring to. so the 123A would be the equivalent of the 2A7V then.)
Edit: adding the base 2A7 instead of the 2A7V would, in my personal opinion, be pointless since the upgrades compared to the 2A6 would then only be:
-Belly mine protection, Barracuda, Aux power and thermals.
It would be doing the same thing as when they added the 122B, the only difference between the 122A and 122B is belly mine protection and a periscope…
Strv 123 isn’t getting “re-geared” like the 2A7V, and the engine isn’t being prepared for an uprate to 1630hp afaik, so it would ‘stay overweight’ whereas 2A7V sacrifaces a bit of its top speed for an increase in acceleration (which imo is more important), and it can be given more power at any point, thus increasing its advantage in acceleration even further.
It’s not yet know whether the Swedes are going with the L/55 or L/55A1, but if its the former, they won’t be able to use the most up do date APFSDS projectiles like M829A4 or DM73 & DM83, meaning Strv 123A would be significantly worse at tank dueling.
It also ain’t getting the APU (and if they model those, 2A7V could operate completely silently, basically staying invisible to thermals).
As far as I know they’re also not replacing the internal armour like they did on the Leopard 2A7V, so it woulda actually be worse armoured.
There’s a few more differences, but overall - the Strv 123A as of now feels like more the MLU upgrade that brings it to Leopard 2E or Leopard 2HEL standards, but not to Leopard 2A7V standards.
their always still is the possibility, it is just always a question of possibility like thodin mentioned already, since sweden and germany arent officialy allied they might have restriction on what they officialy order/upgrade
i don’t see them choosing the base L/55 when all of the 2A7 tanks has been fitted with the new L/55A1 and the pressrelease from Sweden’s defence force say to make it “equal to the other modern Leopard 2’s”. but you are correct, we actually don’t know. (But i feel like choosing the older variant of the gun would be outright stupid x) )
Correct, but i think this will have negligible impact on gameplay if they introduce the Barracuda armor. you can already as it is almost not hear tanks that stand still in game.
This depends, during the upgrade from 122A to 122B they also made “several internal changes” to achieve “satisfactory protection” (source: http://www.ointres.se/2011-03-18_pansar_strv122b.pdf). but what those are and what they mean we don’t know. But i would venture a guess that they are the same that Canada did when they upgraded 2A6 to 2A6M.
the 123A would also have extra mine protection, better thermals and the Barracuda system compared to the 2E. (and would that not make it a 2A7V (with worse engine and APU) if we just look at the upgrades that matter in game?)
It looks like they’re talking about the Strv 122B+ there. The “normal” 122B is just an 122A with a mine-plate.
But i would venture a guess that they are the same that Canada did when they upgraded 2A6 to 2A6M.
This would mean the removal of the lowest row of ammunition in the hull rack and a new FP system designed to prevent ammunition fires + some spall liners on the inside of the turret basket.
That is not correct. the first part of the document talks about history and the part i quoted is about the 122B. if you can read Swedish then the bottom two paragrafs in the middle column on the first page are of interest to the 122B. the 122B+ is talked about from the last paragraf of the right column on the first page and onwards.
sounds about right, but as i stated, its just a guess from me and the Swedish military is known for saying as little as possible (“en svensk tiger”).
And it’s talking about “satisfactory mine protection”. So yes, it is exactly the same as what they did on the 2A6M CAN - and nothing to do with the tank’s composite.
correct.
does the Leopard 2A7V get extra internal armour above this 2A6—>2A6M upgrade?
Because what you quoted is discussing the internal changes specifically.
A bit of an update and compilation so far:
Leopard:
The 2A5 —> 2A6 upgrade is basically only the L/44 — > L/55 gun upgrade
The 2A6 —> 2A6M upgrade is mine protection and might even include some external armor used by Canada in Afghanistan (source: Product Information | KMW)
The 2A6M —> 2A7V is the upgrade of: internal systems, Barracuda camo, same external armor used by Canadas 2A6M in Afghanistan (put onto non upgraded 2A7), better thermals/night vision, upgraded L/55A1 gun with programmable ammo and better APU.
Strv:
122A: is a Leopard 2A5 with upgraded armor.
122B: Added Mine protection in the same manor as the 2A6M (both internally and externally) and Barracuda camo.
122B+ (only a technical demonstrator!): added more external armor.
123A: adds the L/55 gun (original or A1 variant unknown, but they mention programmable ammo, anyone know if both L/55 and L/55A1 can use programmable?), new night sights (and or thermals, it seems a bit unclear) and internal electrical components to make it equivalent to “other modern Leopard 2’s”
so the main differences i can see between the strv 123A and the Leopard 2A7V is the engine, APU and remote controlled weapon station.
anyone see any more differences?
Edit, removed RWS turret from 2A7V after more information was given.
Tbh theres probs alot of Info on the new 123 left out of the initial order its best to wait for more information to release later on that would hopefully release closer to the expected production date
Absolutely ^^
Its just fun to speculate and have a smal glimmer of hope of an early WT addition around the same time (or soon after) the addition of the Leopard 2A7V :)
is the 2A7V and the 2A7+ not the exact same end result built from two different bases? (i.e; 2A7V is built from 2A6M and 2A7+ is built from base 2A7) or have i misunderstood this?