Mates I work in a field in my employment that is considered mentally difficult, lol, but I have always been a quick learner, Ive never really met a textbook I had problems with…But the fact of the matter is I am not a quick learner in Warthunder Ive realized, it is what it is, Im really good in a plane, after a while, but I am not the person who has the most incredible stats, because for some reason I wont unbend my mind to the plane. LOL
Ive been playing Warthunder since Beta, thats props and now good uptier jets. I consider myself a good dogfighter, however, there is one point I get to sometimes with a good defensive opponent, or my own defense…the Stall Fight! I do not have the numbers, but I would say I die 90% of the time in a stall fight. This has been since 2012 and Im sick of it,… Im not getting something (I am just now becoming proficient at notching fox 3s).
Sometimes, in my employ, I have to do an ergonomic study of people’s workstations, and I train people, and so sometimes (in all kinds of environments), I will say, "OK look, this is the first thing and key point that should enter your mind…etc. in a certain situation.
WHAT IS THE KEY AND FIRST THING THAT MY MIND SHOULD GO TO IN A STALL FIGHT?
if you’re at stall speeds the only way to increase lift would be using flaps, you can landing flaps to provide the most lift however you will bleed speed much faster than just using combat or takeoff so you should only do it in certain cases to give yourself a little more lift for the shot.
Hmmm…thats the first thing that pops in YOUR mind, your flaps…I know mate, Im good with my flaps in props and jets, some planes have different limits as you well know…
You know what, this question just enters my mind…Perhaps the flaps and not reducing the throttle too much? I am big on throttle control,…but maybe Im using my flaps and decreasing the throttle too much?
Know what I mean, not having the energy to get my guns around to the target?, Decreasing my energy so much, I cant get my plane to handle or “direct”…the energy you still have in a “stall”
Thank You for your help, that made me think about something, possibly the throttle, the energy, the flaps, …still while in a stall (if you will) being able to have some semblence of control.
Im a kid that grew up with a WW2 grandfather who flew…and so I always liked planes. I used to buy 100 sheets of paper for cheap with my allowance, fold them up and then my bed was the aircraft carrier. All the planes are a curiosity to me, but I hate to f***king lose to!, when Im playing serious which I always dont.
Thank you, that made me think about something.
It has been a while since i have done props. But i can say what i first think for jets.
“How can i avoid his guns”
I focus on making sure that whatever i do will allow me to avoid him getting a shot on me.
Of course there are other things to worry about but none of that matters if he gets rounds on target.
Imho stall fights in the classic sense describe mainly fights near stall speed either trying to energy trap aggressors or attempts to catch guys trying to energy trap you.
Sometimes the term is applicable whilst energy fighting - so in vertical scissors avoiding gun solutions for opponents until one of them is running out of lift.
The outcome of those fights are from my pov decided by:
- Correct judgement of energy states before the fight even started
- Power to weight ratio of aircraft involved and acceleration
- Changes of power to weight ratio at different alt due to changes of available engine power and effects of different fuel loads
- The stall speed of involved aircraft
- Positioning & experience of involved players
Effects:
-
It boils down that a hell of guys trying to energy trap people misjudge the necessary vertical and horizontal distance to avoid stall shots as the chasing aircraft can stay lower.
-
Same as a lot of guys trying to perform such stall shots underestimate the time they need to stabilize their aircraft after they stalled out or the loss of energy / lift if their target is climbing in spirals.
Recommendation:
Imho flap usage in such fights is rather counterproductive as the increased drag slows the aircraft down (if being chased) - therefore flap usage makes just sense in order to drop on a stalled out enemy to get a shot, or to stabilize your aircraft near stall speed to control the direction of your drop after being stalled out.
So if you claim you die 90% in stall fights, i would focus on the the 5 points i mentioned. Imho the main factor would be the correct assessment of energy states and full transparency of strengths and weaknesses of the involved aircraft.
As long if you are able to decide when, where and at which altitude fights will happen you have the initiative, even if you get chased by an enemy with a higher energy state.
It all comes down to energy doesnt it…good comment
First thing that comes to mind for me is if it’s even possible. If my enemy has a significant engine power or lift advantage, then stall fighting doesn’t work too well.
When fighting delta wings, however, it’s quite either to bleed their energy even in small turns. You can use this to make them stall before you.
If you’re in a stall fight, you should be using full real controls. That’s the only thing you need.
1: Energy Advantage
2: Flaps