That is way too much of a simplification. It has been discussed to death on the r77 thread but youre not completely wrong but not necessarily right either. And as far as the game coae its not hugely relevant either .
Ive seen ADA416637 used to support that and i feel thats extremely reductive and a bit disengenuos.
Hardly vitriolic. The thread was locked because a bunch of “random” people brigaded the thread fishing for reason to close it down, reading the last 30/40 makes it pretty obvious
I think a lot of ppl that have been saying the R-77s are underperforming are just parroting what some ppl of dubious credibility have been spoutting with little to no evidence tbh.
iirc, R-77’s have been given the same drag profile as planar fined missiles, but with increased drag attributed to lattice fins.
They are likely overperforming at low-mid speed launch conditions which are typically seen in-game, while they might be underperforming at very high alt/speeds which are rarely seen in-game. They might be underperforming in energy retention in high AOA pull as well, but realistically, theyre likely better for in-game conditions as currently modelled.
I dont think ive yet seen any actual sources proving the missile to be underperforming, just anecdotal inferences from pro-russian players that believe the lattice fin design to be the greatest aerodynamuc marvel to have ever graced AAMs (weird how theyve only ever been used on the R-77 series of AAMs and not one other country has thought it was a good idea to replicate if thats the case…)
It’s real lol, stay mad
1 F-15 damaged. It probably never flew again but with F-15’s durability wouldn’t be surprised
the airframe is better plus it would buff a vehicle in Britain lmao
(the radar is basically useless, its really crap so idk if it can even take advantage of the better missile much)
So 2 Eagles shot down (being generous)? That’s it? That still puts it in top 2 best KD ratios of any fighter jet. (Assuming the Tomcat got 160 kills and 3 deaths, which would put it at Number 1)
F-15 KDR: 52:1
F-14: KDR: 53:1 (most likely lower however, into the 130s, putting it at 43:1)
So how does this alleged incident change anything? The Eagle still holds the crown by far.
You forgot the most important part, the F-15’s were not even shot down to begin with and it’s all just alleged
the 120c-5 isnt as OP as everyone thinks, if you look at the files (you can grab from data mines or from other people) I did the math.
While saying this I do believe the other missiles should be fixed aswell. Just figured I spent the 2 hours doing the math and datamining and might aswell post the results.
They were fighting mig 21 and 23 whoopie with all the support in the world.
I think the issue is, once the 120C-5 gets fixed, it would be a heck of a strong missile. I understand F-18 getting one, but seriously the F-15E/I? You can’t deny it’s absurd
“It’s alleged so it never happened.”
I don’t think that is how that works. If it’s alleged you can’t conclude that the opposite is true. If it’s alleged than neither side of the story is confirmed.
If you actually look at the KDR/KPS of 14.0 jets, the F-15E/I and F/A-18Cs are the worst performing jets, which is likely why gaijins adding the 120C-5 to them. You can feel free to disagree with the justification, but thats the most likely reason as far as I can tell.
All 14.0 jets are VASTLY underperforming the Rafale tho, which is likely why the 120C-5 is being tested on the poorest performing airframes (and likely will come to other airframes in the near future), and likely also why the R-27EA is in discussion, as its all Russia has left before it goes into better fox 2’s and R-37M’s.
Atleast, thats the logical conclusion one would make considering the numbers available to the public atm. Gaijin may have other plans or justifications at the end of the day.
People constantly are complaining about the Pantsir and the Kh-38MT.
Just because these complaints aren’t being discussed as much on this side of the forum doesn’t mean that these complaints don’t exist.
The F-15E and F-15I Ra’am getting these new missiles isn’t good for the balance and people claiming that this will balance the USSRs CAS/SPAA dominance is nonsensical, as this CAS/SPAA dominance doesn’t exist in ARB.
The USSR tree shouldn’t have the Pantsir and the Kh-38MT, but them having these weapons doesn’t justify the addition of AIM-120C-5s to the F-15E and F-15I Ra’am.
1 F-15 shot down 2 MiG-29 in late 90’s
Iraqis said both were shot down, USAF said 1 was damaged by the missile
Pantsir was OP when it was added it has been powercrept to dust now by newer CAS. I even made a thread recently asking for help because i have been spading it and the advice given for fighting things like typhoons and strike eagles rafales etc was to just hide from them if they know what they are doing.
I really hope the new spaa is good, but im not holding my breath.
It still is rather strong as it can reliably shoot down incoming missiles and bombs.
Don’t get me wrong, it definitely is getting outclassed by CAS and will finally get some proper competition in the coming update, but currently it still is the strongest SPAA/SAM in the game.
C-5 isnt op, the 38mt is… atleast not the c5 in game
Yeah exactly. So since neither side has proven anything and it’s allegedly, that means neither side is confirmed.
You pretty much said “it’s allegedly so it’s not true”. Which is also just blatant bias.