A physical disability that can make movement difficult like for example mh right side dosint work as well as my left which on keyboard or controller for a game like this can be difficult to use that why I’m saying what i am for a rework
I don’t have an issue with Gaijin making bombers more realistically damage resistant but for Simulator battles they need to realistically nerf or remove mouse aim gunners.
Bombers (especially the Ju288) have highly suspect flight models at times and in SB scumbags use and abuse them as heavy fighters in the capture zones due to the 360 degree stabilized gunner view. Adding a much tougher damage model on top of this would make things even more toxic.
Sounds like a WT problem.
Which means it’s an artificial problem created by the developers not being willing to spent time to change it.
Just deal with it ;)
3 Likes
No.
What they need to do is better model internal spaces, including the turrets. No idea how’d you not make it very very annoying to select the right turret, but then have the player limited to first person, firing from the turrets. Mouse aim is fine, you are a heavy bomber, flying solo usually, some advantage I think is acceptable. The issue is the third person giving you a massive situational awarness advantage that means fighters cant be sneaky
3 Likes
The issue is making the first person gunner views work without being janky. Switching to the tail gunner in an IL-2 is easy, imagine cycling through views on something like a B-17 against a moving target.
I’d also model the gun sights correctly and remove the in game aiming sight.
3 Likes
General discussion
Why is it that 27 mm shells from a typhoon doesn’t rip a su30’s wings off but WWII 20 mm cannons can rip a bomber’s wings off? I’m not quite sure if Gaijin modeled modern airframes correctly, but I’ve seen several WWII bombers having shells pass through the wings and even engine without causing the bomber to disintegrate mid air. I know BVVD said they plan on fixing this but I remember 5 years ago playing WWII bombers and it being way more survivable than now.
It’s be because the gun mostly fires AP ammo:
Gaijin overbuffed HE because most cannons rely on explosive shells to kill aircraft, according to Gaijin, and players don’t like to hit aircraft more than 3 times to kill them 🤷♂️
So anything that isn’t explosive is simply less effective.
Simple fix. Just have the gun fire HE exclusively and it’s instantly the best cannon.
1 Like
actually bombers are so fragile - played air arcade and 90% of my deaths were caused by breaking the stern of the fuselage - its totally ridicoulos!!
Bombers Structural Damage model should be more durable and stronger, Not Like the Current Implemented Stick durability in game, I would love to see a rework and a more historically accurate Structural Durability against bullets and missile.
4 Likes
But what will the moron who will die to the gunners do!
“gunners OP!???”
“Nerf gunners bc I stood still behind an enemy bomber defensive armament for 5 seconds and gave time to the bomber to adjust for parallax!”
Im pretty sure B-66’s radar didn’t come because 1, too much work, and 2, people would be complainin about it.
If a buff to bombers comes, a lot of people will cry about it, so better be ready.
For me bombers should recieve an artificial reduction of blast damage from calibers below 30mm, maybe even 37mm. Reduce to the damage of AP rounds and make AP rounds a counter to bombers via sniping engines, gunners, control surfaces, etc. (just that loading screen tip applied to the game.)
“Tail cut off” mechanic needs an entire rework, model tail spars and make calibers below 50cal unable to damage them.
IDK about missiles
B-17 vs sparrow missile
Sparrow Missile Shoot Down Boeing B-17 Flying Fortress - YouTube
6 Likes
WT playerbase complain too much about realism, the Ragebaits are Enormous in this community, especially when it comes to Adding real life stuff, the other players simply cry about it too much, its is not it because its “unfair”, its because its Realistic Like REAL LIFE, and they dont want it to be like real life.
They want something to simply either an unrealistic mechanic abuse, or Dont add it, they dont give too much options to the WT developers except denying the Mechanic suggestion if its not suitable.
I agree with you about the Damage Remodeling scheme, If war thunder is a realistic, reality related game, that cares about the “Tiny Details”, it should add such mechanics, even all the mechanics, war thunder is like a Multi million company and they cant even program the simpliest things such as the 3 dimensional Stabilizer for the Turm III for example, It really frustrating and sad.
Hope WT not getting consumed by absolute greed, And the Type of Players Community opinions that simply Want to reduce WT realism. And i got to confirm not all this players community are Not well, i am saying there is in every community that types of players, Respectfully.
2 Likes
damage models in general need a rework cause what do you mean 1 50Cal can blow off my wing doing same damage as 20MM cannon ? in a fighter
4 Likes
From my pov your suggestion does not deal with the reasons why bombers in general have damage models like paper aircraft. Your idea just make sense without knowing why wt changed their handling of hits on bombers.
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Long term players meet from time to time the legend @fmt3 - 24.294 hours of bomber experience and ~ 138.000 matches. You might check his vehicle stats. He might be able to tell the current player base what changes happened to bombers - and why.
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Even as i am not that long active I remember the days with delayed kills (= B kills) in one hour long battles. You scored a crit triggering a “enemy player lost tail control” message (and you broke off due to damage, fuel or missing ammo) and half an hour later you got credited with a kill when the bomber pilot failed to land just with his flaps (as he had no elevator control) or (what happened way more often) that a scumbag aka as team mate stole your kill by strafing your target on final approach.
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Idk when exactly gaijin changed this to the current “Michael Bay” effects - but out of nowhere you got suddenly way too much show effects and instant kills. It boils down that gaijin satisfied the PvP player base with instant bomber (and fighter) kills (A kills) in order to stop kill stealing.
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If you look close enough you simply ask that gaijin reintroduces these “B” kills by removing the “A” kills.
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If you have some friends playing Air SB you might know that certain effects like weather or damage models are valid for all 3 modes (AB, RB, SB) and that it is not really rare to see see long term players in SB with ultra-high K/D ratios in B-25s as even with limited gunner ammo they have a severe spotting and aiming advantage whilst effective combat ranges for fighters are way smaller.
If you agree that Air RB in its current form is just a glorified Air AB+ mode (there is no real realism in RB) and you watch the majority of the guys you meet in matches (toddlers/kids and casual players) it is imho quite obvious that these players have neither the skill nor the patience for such proposals - and gaijin is fully aware of it.
Even if bombers would have a way stronger damage model - this would not solve the actual issues of bombers like high risk - low reward game play, manual gunner nerfs or too high BRs for bombers combined with clueless players of bombers AND fighters…
To prove my point - the bomber with the most advanced damage model inwt:
I see these bombers every few days, the damage model is still broken and you need a pilot snipe or hitting the bombload to kill them - it flies without wings and tail and 3 burning engines 😂
5 Likes
YES
i don’t want my Pe-8 to get it’s wing pulverized by a P-61C at 1.6km like what happened to me in 2021.
1 Like
Bro got so traumatized he still remembers it to this day
(I understand)
2 Likes
I think the damage models arent the problem i think guns are the problem all planes fall apart from 1 20mm cannon
the only problem with nerfing guns is that certain planes become unplayable for example planes with less than 120Rounds of ammo like YAK-15
couldnt find a photo of his p47 after
for example robert s johnsons P47
Spoiler
fter pulling out of the uncontrolled spin and with the fire amazingly going out on its own, Johnson headed for the English Channel but was intercepted by a single Fw 190. The German fighter began pumping rounds into the helpless Thunderbolt. Bullets and cannon shells tore through the fuselage. Johnson jolted every time a shell thumped into the armor plate. Johnson alternatively hit the rudder pedals to throw off the enemy’s aim, causing him to overshoot, briefly giving Johnson the advantage. Johnson fired off a couple of rounds before the German looped around to pull up to Johnson’s wing. The pilot looked over Johnson’s plane, then shook his head in disbelief, then waved at Johnson before getting back behind him to attack again. After another assault of gunfire, the German pilot once again pulled up to Johnson’s wing. He waved again before maneuvering to make a final attack. The German manipulated his rudder to move side to side as he fired, spraying Johnson wingtip to wingtip. Unable to fight back, he maneuvered while under a series of attacks, and although sustaining further heavy damage from hundreds of 7.92 mm rounds, managed to survive until the German ran out of ammunition. The German for a final time pulled up to Johnson’s wing. He rocked his wings to salute Johnson, then turned back. His opponent was possibly the commander of III/JG 2, Major Egon Mayer.[2] [N 1] However, this theory remains unverified. After landing, Johnson tried to count the bullet holes in his airplane but gave up after the tally passed 200 – without even moving around the aircraft. He also saw the 20 mm shell that had exploded behind his headrest and jammed his canopy.[4]
After landing, Johnson tried to count the bullet holes in his airplane but gave up after the tally passed 200 – without even moving around the aircraft. He also saw the 20 mm shell that had exploded behind his headrest and jammed his canopy.[4]
4 Likes
20mils are simply too powerful towards bombers, it leaves actual “anti bomber” like +30mm caliber cannons redundant since they will normally sacrifice firerate, ballistics, ammo pool or all of the above for more punch towards bombers.
4 Likes
you missed the point entirely its every plane there op against
P47 for example rugged plane has taken over 200 rounds of damage and can run with missing piston Dies from one 20mm
again the IL2 a strike plane can be one tapped shot in half when IRL they can survive like this
6 Likes
So 20mils are in a situation like aphe is for tank battles, dominates the battles in such ways that changing it generates a lot of backlash from parts of the community.
2 Likes