Sea Harrier FA2 & AV-8B+ - Suggestion for Stock Grind improvement

Dev Server Seek & Destroy General Discussion - Dev Server
1

These 2 aircraft are going (and the AV-8B+ when it eventually comes to the US TT) are going to have a perticularly rough time when it comes to the stock grind. They both start with 2xAim-9Ls on sub-sonic airframes at 12.3. This is a 10.3 loadout at best for these airframes. So 12.3, vs super-sonic AMRAAM slingers is going to be hard work.

Sea Harrier FA2 gets 4x Aim-9Ls at rank 1, Aim-9M at rank 3 and Aim-120B at Rank 4.

AV-8B+ gets 4x Aim-9Ls at Rank 3, Aim-9Ms at Rank and Aim-120As at Rank 4.

For these aircraft to be even slightly effective. They are going to have a very long and rough grind. So I propose some improvements.

First and foremost. AV-8B+ needs its 4x Aim-9L loadout moved to rank 1. This would give it the biggest buff in regards to stock grind. but Aim-9Ms should be moved to Rank 3 as welll. This puts it on parity with the Sea Harrier FA2. If nothing else changes. This should.

For the AV-8B+ I also propose it recieves some A2G weapons stock. Such as the rocket pods. To further assist in the stock grind and remove a mod to allow for AAM mods to move about.

After that, I propose changes to the stock loadout for both aircraft.

1 - 2x Aim-9M stock
2 - 4x Aim-9L stock

Additioanlly. The Sea Harrier FA2 and AV-8B+ get their Aim-120s as a Rank 4 mod. But for the equally limited aircraft, the F4F-ICE, it gets them at Rank 3. I also propose that Aim-120 be moved to a Rank 3 mod for both aircraft. Allowing them to be unlocked much sooner. This is perticuarly impactful for the Sea Harrier FA2

Should the AV-8B+'s 4x Aim-9L mod be Rank 1 instead of Rank 3?

  • Yes
  • No
0 voters

Should AV-8B+ get Stock rocket pods?

  • Yes
  • No
0 voters

Stock loadout for Both Harriers

  • Leave loadouts as they are
  • 1 - 2x Aim-9M
  • 2- 4x Aim-9L
  • Other (please comment below)
0 voters

Should the Aim-120 modifications be moved to Rank 3?

  • Yes
  • No
0 voters
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2

Harriers are already going to suffer because they will never have the range aspect of AMRAAM launches.
Hence they require something…
Like a br of 12.3 and then these modifications.
Ice should also get something similar but A2G is severally restricted on both sides

3

Yes and no… Unfortunately it doesnt mean much in game. But IRL the Sea Harrier FA2 out ranged quite a lot, because it was quite happy sitting at 30k ft where most other aircraft were to fuel hungry for that altitude and instead sat about 20k ft.

In game though. We’ll have to wait and see how big of an impact of only being subsonic has on these airframes

4

Being subsonic it is kind of obvious these planes are going to have a rough time of it on the stock grindset, the SHAR FRS.1 proves that already by being a 10.3 plane with 2x 9Ls as a similarish airframe at least to the FA2 (engine upgrade ofc but still).

The GR7 shows that 4 aim9 L or 2 Ms would be a good base armament at the very least as it tends to do well with those even in a combat system designed against it.

AMRAAM being easier to get too should also be a given, as they are subsonic planes which will be the last into the fight every time and so having more reach would be helpful to that, also just simply not having the same dogfight power should mean a bit easier standoff should be thought about.

Finally, make the SHAR FA2 a fighter role and thought about on that side with the armament unlocks! Yes it can act as a CAS platform, but so can the phantoms, those are classed as fighters still and get much more advanced A2G then the SHAR has.

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5

Yeah, Im planning a seperate thread for that. But I want to find some “historical information” to back up my case for that

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6

I’m pretty sure I’ve seen a picture of sea harrier with 6 of the ARHs but no sidewinders, am I wrong in this? That might help it if that was a possible configuration, assuming ARHs aren’t terrible from such a launch platform.

But yea, these changes are pretty much necessary unless the sea harrier gets sent down in BR, which would be a bit questionable but honestly not the most questionable decision they’ve made.

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Not doable according to the FA2 flight manuals unfortunately.

8

In that case, yeah. These are kinda the only solutions short of BR drop.

9

Yep, doing the stock grind on the dev server as we speak. Its rather brutal. The FM is overperforming hard on the dev server (i think) but you cant get kills. Aim-9Ls are just too easy to defeat. 1 falre and done

10

There is also the option of 2 stock ARHs. It’d be a bit outside of what they normally do, but they also don’t normally have subsonics fighting at the highest BRs against stuff that completely makes them irrelevant. For some reason post ate half my sentence.

11

I doubt they’d ever get ARH stock unfortunately. AV-8B+ could get Aim-7 stock I think. By FA2 cant use SARH at all.

12

I feel like at BR 12.3, the SHar will be ok, but eventually will go down to 12.0.

Reason being, it’s speed.

Other AMRAAM carrier travelling above Mach will have greater flight range on their AMRAAMs. The SHar…and the AV8B+ for that matter, won’t have the same ‘legs’ as a considerable amount of energy will be wasted by the missile getting itself above Mach.

On topic though, 9Ls stock on anything at this BR is gonna suck. 2x 9M should be the standard, and their hardly an OP missile, quite easily countered if you know how the IRCCM works within them.

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13

Problem is you are comparing an FA.2 which is specifically a fighter aircraft with an AV8B+ which is a strike aircraft, the Gr7 which is the AV8B equivalent also doesn’t have aim9Ms at rank 1, why should the AV8B+ be any different, oh yeah, because it’s American not British

In regards to A2G, why should it? No other top tier aircraft gets stock A2G weapons unless it’s solely a strike aircraft, for example Tornado and Su25, whereas the harrier is a strike Fighter that receives 9Ls stock and it’s an aicraft which in recent times has been used more for air superiority, e.g. in the gulf with Gr7-9 being used to patrol the airspace along with Tornado ADV and F15

14

In general I feel like the ARH carriers should get better missiles stock than SARH carriers. The former has a BR based on the ARH missiles they get, when in other areas they may be the same as lower BR planes. For example, the Tornado F.3 with SuperTEMP and 9Ls is 11.3, swapping those for AIM-120B and 9M gives it a bump from 11.3 to 12.7. Similarly, the SHar FA.2 has the same weapon loadout stock as the best possible on the FRS.1(e) at 10.3, and then the twin 9L rails match the weaponry of the FRS.1(l) at 10.7.

I’m obviously looking at this from a British perspective, I’m sure other aircraft will be in a similar boat, but it would be nice if the rank 8/~12.0+ air gets the same treatment as the Su-27 and gets a limited load of IRCCM missiles stock, so you at least have a slightly better chance of killing something.

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15

I can’t imagine how a subsonic aircraft with only 2 AIM9L missiles without helmet aiming and poor manoeuvrability can develop AIM-120B in 12.3?

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16

Yeah… gunna be a rough time grinding that. Thankfully i’ll be doing it in SB. But its still not going to be easy (just slightly easier)

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