F c = R/m⋅v2+m⋅g⋅tan(ϕ)+T⋅sin(α)−L⋅cos(α)
If you need formula XD
I could be wrong but twr doesn’t directly help with rate but helping twr helps turn indirectly by either decreasing weight = tighter turn radius for a certain speed and increasing thrust = faster speed at a certain radius? So better twr essentially means better turn?
dude… what is the centrifugal force has to do with the max rate of turn… STR is that not the Fc… please do not mix random formulas hoping to find a good one :,(
you literally wrote that here:
“Cause for example of EM diagrams like F-16,F-18,M2000 these planes have both better T/W and Wing load can’t reach similar performance”
how can a F-16 and a F-18 have better wingloads? and again TWR is irrelevant in a sustained turn rate
Oh I never said it was underperforming at all…it’s the best turning top tier plane in the game and it’s not even by a small margin. But it is not doing 20 degrees per second at 20 AoA…even on minimum fuel.
There also isn’t any very reliable info on the way that it should be turning. Anecdotally according to Swede pilots it should be on par with the F-16 maneuverability wise…but also pilot reports and stories don’t really clarify how they are winning a dogfight or the circumstances. I.E winning could just be “yep went super aggressive for AoA shot and I just hit those because I am the GOAT” or it can be “I just held .03 degrees per second turn rate better for 10 minutes and because his first turn was bad I still won”.
To archives better turn you need more LIFT. To get more lift you increase AoA. But when you increase your AoA with LIFT you get DRAG. To counter DRAG you need more THRUST.
But where does weight play into this? Just improve wing loading?
Nothing mate that why I’m literally don’t wanna discuss with you. Read more bock meybe pass some exams
yes, but in a SUSTAINED TURN RATE THE DRAG IS EQUAL TO THRUST BECAUSE YOU ARE NOT ACCELERATING OR DECELERATING THAT’S WHY IN THE FUCKING RATE OF TURN FORMULA DRAG AND THRUST ARE NOT ACCOUNTED FOR
Yes that why it’s highly doubt that Grippen can do 20deg/s
It’s not accounted now find the same equation with thrust and weight. And calculate… It’s not possible for this plane to sustain 20deg/s
we’re asking him like 30 times by now, no answer in that if not only elitist nosense about being an engineer
you are just ignorant as a rock dude, i’m going to show my teachers and classmates that and we will all laugh at your “engineering degree”
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Thrust to weight can have an impact on sustained turning performance when vertical elements are factored in. However I think it is an oversimplification to say that the Gripen should turn worse than the Mirage 2K simply because “muh thrust to weight ratio”.
Simply put a plane with worse thrust to weight might out turn another one just because the way that it turns also costs it less energy to do so. In props the Ta-152H is probably the most obvious and extreme example because it is practically a glider.
It doesn’t sustain 20 degrees per second at low speeds like you claimed. It sustains about 1 degree more per second at low speeds than the Mirage 2000.
Do we even know the mirage 2000 has better twr at the speed both planes rate at? Static thrust is borderline useless for determining actual acceleration. I can make charts showing twr at different speeds for both planes but I can’t at the moment.
I’m not care what you think. You have formula sustain turn. It’s not there thrust because it’s Equal drag so it’s out from equation. And just try convince people that thrust it’s not important lol. Just find the same equation with thrust and drag put into online calculator increase thrust and you will see what happen with turn rate
End of discussion from my side every one can check facts by yourself
mir2000 and gripen, both at 50% internal fuel, do have similar TWR (0.9 the gripen, 0.93 the mirage), but gripen does have less drag and canards to overcompensate
How it’s can have lower drag when Mirage is faster ??
Funny how this guy is all “end of discussion” and insists on not wanting to talk anymore when he ran into an actual engineer 😂
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because mirage 2000 has like 15KN of thrust more?